the thing is, the reason why people generally excuse a person being a murderer is cuz that person *usually* has a reason behind it. over here, its pretty apparent that guwon does not have his morals in check - for whatever reason. people are even theorising its cuz he has been brainwashed to think this way, or that he was taught these things from the beginning. rape, on the other hand, has no reason behind it. it can never ever be excused.
i hope this makes sense.
exactly, you don't rape in self defense for example, rape is merely to strip someone of their dignity while killing in this also twisted scenario seems to be "sparing them" or "punishing them"
NOT TRYING TO ARGUE but im trying to understand. What i took from what you said is that readers are more likely to excuse a character’s actions (in this case it’s murder) if they have a reason verses rape, because rape is inexcusable.
In pearl boy, the ML never rapes the MC. However, the ML does get someone else raped, the reason being was bc that person was the reason the MC was raped. Does that mean that the rape is excusable since there is reason behind it the same way that murder is excusable for gunwon because he has no moral compass?
Thank you for replying this is actually helpful to me in understanding. I just want to clarify in no shape or form do I condone rape or murder I just want to understand the societal view on why one is excused even though they’re both wrong.
if i talk about ur specific example, correct me if im wrong but doesnt dooshik get the twin who wasnt involved raped? i read it a long time ago but thats what i remember, and i felt it was really disgusting since the person who wasnt involved was raped and the one who originally arranged the gang rape for the mc only saw his twin get raped.
anyway, to answer ur question *in my opinion* rape should never ever be used as a punishment. as a survivor myself, and this is what I've heard from others too, i would never ever want someone, even if they're a rapist themself, to go through the same thing as i did.
oh another point about pearl boy, when dooshik arranged the gang rape he did it for himself. it did NOT help the mc in any way. also the people who raped the twin were not the ones who were wronged either, he just helped normal rapists get their way. thats really not acceptable, and he was weird as fuck for that.
my apologies for getting some information mixed up about pearl boy. Also i’m sorry to hear that you’ve experienced rape and to be able to help me understand you’re putting yourself out there on a topic that’s harmful to you. This helped me understand why people are choosing to side with gunwon and with good reason for that. Have a blessed day.
totally fine glad we could have this convo !!!
I think the reason why people side with Guwon is because he has a childlike innocence as if he's not completely understanding what he's doing. It's obvious he was programmed to think a certain way. Or someone convinced him that he needed to those things. Kinda like how if a kid commited crime, you don't really blame the kid, rather you blame their environment growing up and the people who raised them. Because having childlike innocence means you are also a victim of the situation. Either you were brainwashed or manipulated to do certain things you wouldn't really do normally or you were abused and treated in such a way that you start thinking that's normal behaviour. People aren't siding with Guwon because they don't think what he did was bad, it's because they don't why he did that. They aren't sure if he was just brainwashed or manipulated or he just suddenly woke up one day and chose violence.
yes after talking with gojos cock sleeve (lol) I came to the understanding that what they were saying makes sense. Readers were siding with gunwon ONLY because of the reason he has rather than what he did. Even though murder and rape is a serious crime, there’s never a reason for rape since murder is usually excused in situations where it’s self defense or accidental. Thanks to what Booh said I understand there’s never a situation where rape can be used as self defense which renders rape as inexcusable. Thanks to you I’m getting another perspective on gunwon.
Lol i got hella confused cause you mentioned talking to gojo's cock sleeve
i agree 100%!! imo, it speaks to a deeper issue about the audience & how they view men/authority. they can side with it, even if they commit heinous actions if it means they like them or feel as if they *know* them. since we don’t know much about guwon, they can only project onto him.
they blame the doc for being a coward, they blame the villagers for using guwon, & they see other people as evil instead of holding him accountable. i fear that guwon would need to commit genocide or rape to be viewed as a monster.
when people wonder why certain figures are able to rise up into power & hurt groups of people, guwon is a good example on why.
Yes thank you for understanding and sharing your thoughts as well. You worded everything that I said perfectly, I agree with your take. However, after speaking with others under the comment they helped me see another point that maybe the readers aren’t siding with his actions but rather the reason he has which makes his murder acceptable. But than again, some of the reasons are theoretical. When the truth comes out good or bad I hope we can hold gunwon accountable.
I also seen blaming and others trying to hold everyone else but gunwon accountable. I think that the villagers felt like they could get pass what gunwon was doing so that’s why he rose up in power. Than again it’s an apocalypse happening so murder happens all the time as a form of self defense.
Discussing with different people made me see that as of right now I can’t side with gunwons actions or his reasoning because so far in the story I don’t know how true his reasonings are because Sisyphus is a trickster and a liar.
but i genuinely think that the only way yall would turn from gunwon is if he raped the MC. I don’t think i’m crazy for thinking this but all crimes are equally bad. Him killing someone (and he’s killed plenty for no reason) is just as bad (if not worse) than if he was to rape the MC. Rn it seems like yall (the ones who are) are picking and choosing acceptable behavior. If gunwon was to do something horrific to the MC that’s when yall would consider not siding with him. But to each their own.
Not hating on the character bc i’m neutral and im not picking sides i just want to see how it ends. please be respectful under my comment if you have an opinion about what I said. Also I completely understand from an apocalyptic standpoint that his killing had to be done, there definitely can’t be any deadweight.