also, im curious. Has there ever been a manhwa where they switch? Been reading for years and Ive never seen one LGtfo
very rarely do i come across any, the only three ive read are playtime with hakdo, like a tidal wave(luv that, theyre also abo and initially omega tops), and rise of moonsoo which is a very short one
its an annoying part of most yaoi being just a straight couple with the woman turned into a bottom man, with the way standard fictional female mc traits are thrown at the bottoms, and the way most couples don't ACTUALLY have equal standing and how rigidly the sex roles are held up.. its annoying to notice after many reads and realizing theres actually not much real variety
very rarely do i come across any, the only three ive read are playtime with hakdo, like a tidal wave(luv that, theyre also abo and initially omega tops), and rise of moonsoo which is a very short oneits an anno... Slytherinlarrie
Meh, I eat that shit up. I dont expect realism. I like the twink feminine ukes actually, but I also like the buff ukes so Im spoiled for choice.
also, im curious. Has there ever been a manhwa where they switch? Been reading for years and Ive never seen one LGtfo
It's definitely rare in manhwas, I only know the ones others already mentioned. Mangas do it a bit more ofter tho. Seke and reversible tags are your best bet in this
very rarely do i come across any, the only three ive read are playtime with hakdo, like a tidal wave(luv that, theyre also abo and initially omega tops), and rise of moonsoo which is a very short oneits an anno... Slytherinlarrie
and that's exactly how heteronormativity affects gay relationships. I hate that whenever you try to bring that up, people immediately get defensive like "gay couples can't be heteronormative." Like no, no one said the people in a gay relationship were heteronormative, but what we are saying is that the way other people, especially non gay people, view the relationship is heteronormative; like the whole idea that feminine man = bottom = submissive and masculine man = top = dominant (and that a gay couple needs a feminine partner and a masculine partner) is a direct reflection of how society views straight couples and tries to project it on gay people, which then reflects to the way in which gay couples are written in media.
I think this specific manhwa is doing a good job avoiding this problem, but yeah, in yaoi as a whole, most authors do struggle with this.
You might hate that Im gonna say this but BL is mostly written by and targeted to women so its just gonna be like that. Like arent they like that so women can project? Like most of the popular BL manhwas/mangas have a pretty bottom and they sell really well, so why would they stop doing that. The goal isn't accurate queer rep, but I do think its nice when they do have it. Overall, sorry I dont care if they switch itd be cool if they do tho
You might hate that Im gonna say this but BL is mostly written by and targeted to women so its just gonna be like that. Like arent they like that so women can project? Like most of the popular BL manhwas/mangas... LGtfo
I apologize for the length, but I have a lot of thoughts about this topic.
So, the problem isn't the existence of feminine bottoms or fem/masc gay relationships, but the recycling of heteronormative stereotypes and patriarchal roles. I know that accurate representation isn't the goal, which is fine, but it doesn't excuse the poor writing.
BL as a genre is predominately by women for women, yes, but that's not the issue either.
The lack of gender roles and the power imbalance that comes with being in a heterosexual relationship in a heteronormative and patriarchal society is considered to be BL's main appeal to women; they can experience the romance without it having a generic poorly written female character to reflect themselves to. Yet so many BLs recycle these very roles and stereotypes, which is contradictory.
The way society views women is pretty much how it sees femininity as a whole, and we see a reflection of this if we look at the way femininity is portrayed in most BL. We see that their characterization often has the exact same issues as female characters in straight media; such as their lack of personality and individuality, existing solely for the love interest, being total pushovers, or a seemingly strong character losing their edge once they find their prince charming. This comes from the false idea that femininity is inherently submission and docility.
At the end of the day, my point boils down to that we should be dismantling patriarchy and heteronormativity, not reinforcing them. Femininity and masculinity aren't about submission and dominance, docility and aggression nor does it have anything to do with sexual preferences. Which is exactly why I find it jarring when we often see this one format in BL; an emotionally constipated overbearing top and a soft petite pushover bottom. You can totally write feminine men, and feminine bottoms, without the characters being caricatures of feminine stereotypes. And the same absolutely goes the other way around for masculine men and masculine tops.
As for the switching part; I don't really mind the characters not switching either, I'm just annoyed with authors teasing it and then not committing to it, especially since it's not a rare occurrence. They could easily leave that part out and it wouldn't change the story one bit if switching isn't the intention to begin with.
public class Profile { public static void main(String[] args) { String pronouns = "he/they"; int age = 21; BWAT_fanboy(true); buffBottomLover(true); isDownBadForGrisRubion(true); } }
(some bullshit "code" solely for funsies. bio matches my username at least.)
another vers bait or a rare genuine one, that's the question...
(I've been let down too many times, I do not dare to hope anymore)
But I will hope with you because we do deserve more vers rep!!!
feels like they wont. Authors have the top say that but they never actually switch
also, im curious. Has there ever been a manhwa where they switch? Been reading for years and Ive never seen one
Yeah, just like what happened in Arthur
I feel like if the author is going to draw the switch, it'll be an extra
You should read Thirst, they switched
very rarely do i come across any, the only three ive read are playtime with hakdo, like a tidal wave(luv that, theyre also abo and initially omega tops), and rise of moonsoo which is a very short one
its an annoying part of most yaoi being just a straight couple with the woman turned into a bottom man, with the way standard fictional female mc traits are thrown at the bottoms, and the way most couples don't ACTUALLY have equal standing and how rigidly the sex roles are held up.. its annoying to notice after many reads and realizing theres actually not much real variety
Meh, I eat that shit up. I dont expect realism. I like the twink feminine ukes actually, but I also like the buff ukes so Im spoiled for choice.
Like a Tidal Wave
And if you're okay with some heavy topics, Dark Heaven
Ive read those already but thank you for the recs :3 they were pretty good
and I hate that sm. Like stop teasing it if it's not gonna happen :/
It's definitely rare in manhwas, I only know the ones others already mentioned. Mangas do it a bit more ofter tho. Seke and reversible tags are your best bet in this
and that's exactly how heteronormativity affects gay relationships. I hate that whenever you try to bring that up, people immediately get defensive like "gay couples can't be heteronormative." Like no, no one said the people in a gay relationship were heteronormative, but what we are saying is that the way other people, especially non gay people, view the relationship is heteronormative; like the whole idea that feminine man = bottom = submissive and masculine man = top = dominant (and that a gay couple needs a feminine partner and a masculine partner) is a direct reflection of how society views straight couples and tries to project it on gay people, which then reflects to the way in which gay couples are written in media.
I think this specific manhwa is doing a good
job avoiding this problem, but yeah, in yaoi as a whole, most authors do struggle with this.
You might hate that Im gonna say this but BL is mostly written by and targeted to women so its just gonna be like that. Like arent they like that so women can project? Like most of the popular BL manhwas/mangas have a pretty bottom and they sell really well, so why would they stop doing that. The goal isn't accurate queer rep, but I do think its nice when they do have it.
Overall, sorry I dont care if they switch itd be cool if they do tho
I apologize for the length, but I have a lot of thoughts about this topic.
So, the problem isn't the existence of feminine bottoms or fem/masc gay relationships, but the recycling of heteronormative stereotypes and patriarchal roles. I know that accurate representation isn't the goal, which is fine, but it doesn't excuse the poor writing.
BL as a genre is predominately by women for women, yes, but that's not the issue either.
The lack of gender roles and the power imbalance that comes with being in a heterosexual relationship in a heteronormative and patriarchal society is considered to be BL's main appeal to women; they can experience the romance without it having a generic poorly written female character to reflect themselves to. Yet so many BLs recycle these very roles and stereotypes, which is contradictory.
The way society views women is pretty much how it sees femininity as a whole, and we see a reflection of this if we look at the way femininity is portrayed in most BL. We see that their characterization often has the exact same issues as female characters in straight media; such as their lack of personality and individuality, existing solely for the love interest, being total pushovers, or a seemingly strong character losing their edge once they find their prince charming. This comes from the false idea that femininity is inherently submission and docility.
At the end of the day, my point boils down to that we should be dismantling patriarchy and heteronormativity, not reinforcing them. Femininity and masculinity aren't about submission and dominance, docility and aggression nor does it have anything to do with sexual preferences. Which is exactly why I find it jarring when we often see this one format in BL; an emotionally constipated overbearing top and a soft petite pushover bottom. You can totally write feminine men, and feminine bottoms, without the characters being caricatures of feminine stereotypes. And the same absolutely goes the other way around for masculine men and masculine tops.
As for the switching part; I don't really mind the characters not switching either, I'm just annoyed with authors teasing it and then not committing to it, especially since it's not a rare occurrence. They could easily leave that part out and it wouldn't change the story one bit if switching isn't the intention to begin with.