emma

I for one didn't see it sexually? And I consider myself a pervert

Uh? No.. Never crossed in my mind that scene are porn it was crazy but never porn... if a doctor using lighted tube called an endoscope down your throat to check your inside or using feeding tube to force some food or liquid down to your stomach will you call the doctor inappropriate?

And someone losing their consciousness and have their eyes roll back does that looks like they’re feeling good?

I fail to understand how the tube down her throat was sexualization. All that made me think about is how I hope I never have to experience that at the hospital since it’s something doctors do… that was plain torture as we learn more and more of the things they were doing to Hyena. Making her vomit multiple times like she did to Hyena. Still revenge.

if you think that scene with the tube was sexual then maybe your the problem dude. （￣へ￣）

I think you guys in the reply section are missing OP's point. First off, I'd like to address the repulsive comments about how just because someone finds something overly sexualized or is being fetishized and hence is trying to address the issue makes them the weird one and probably also someone who enjoys it.

What kind of logic is that? By that logic, anyone who assumes someone is sexualizing children or lol is (for example) is also by definition a p*dophile as well then?

Also, can we all stop trying to deny factual things about the manhwa and get a grip on reality? FYI, belly bulge are as you may know very prominent fetishes on the Internet and it isn't creepy/disgusting that OP is criticizing said issues when clearly the manga is actively and explicitly putting YOUNG TEENAGE GIRLS in this kind of fetish situations while with VERY SUGGESTIVE themes/behaviors (e.g. eyes rolling back while a tube is stuffed into their throats).

Even if it wasn't the author actual intentions, you can't deny that it's really explicit and uncomfortable to the point where people are practically ASSUMING it's something fetish-related, because that's how it looks to the readers.


If you like the story or manhwa regardless, that's completely fine, we're not coming after you or anything so don't act so butt hurt when someone actually voices out actual concerning and valid criticisms about it.

I think what you’re missing is that none of us (the one speaking against it) saw it as sexualization. All this was to me was plain torture. What people are into when it comes to porn or sex had nothing to do with my experience as a reader, hence the bewilderment we’re feeling as this being the conclusion taken here. As far as I’m concerned, I find odd for any of that to be seen as sexualization so I spoke up on that. Rather than valid criticism, it’s simply that their own perception differs from ours.

The plain torture is exactly what the whole point of the fetishes/kinks are about. Perhaps you're unaware that there exist fetishes that specifically cater to just pain or downright revolting stuff if not worse. I get that you're bewildered, shocked and possibly disgusted, but OP's "own perception" (hence their own personal criticisms, I don't see the difference nor what point are you exactly trying to prove with that statement) is at the end of the day valid regardless, or at least that's what I think.

Just because YOU "find it odd" or don't think it exist in such a case (sexualization), doesn't mean it does not exist or ceases to. Like you and I both mentioned, perspectives, perceptions, opinions and whatnot am I right?

But what we all CAN'T deny is the irrefutable truth that the manhwa displays content that may disturb the readers due to the fact that said content (whether coincidentally or not) caters to a specific fetish, hence my defense for OP and their opinions.

You guys are all out for OP trying to deem them as some sort of disgusting monster just because they find it odd and creepy. When in reality, I think BOTH sides are equally logical and valid.

Sure, I can see where both perceptions can be valid and yes, I am aware of different kinks and fetishes out there, but when you said this:

“Also, can we all stop trying to deny factual things about the manhwa and get a grip on reality? FYI, belly bulge are as you may know very prominent fetishes on the Internet and it isn't creepy/disgusting that OP is criticizing said issues when clearly the manga is actively and explicitly putting YOUNG TEENAGE GIRLS in this kind of fetish situations while with VERY SUGGESTIVE themes/behaviors (e.g. eyes rolling back while a tube is stuffed into their throats).”

You sounded like you actually believe the author’s goal was sexualization and that they should’ve toned it down because there can be no other reason outside of torture as to why the girls in the midst of torture, are portrayed the way they are. You might not mean it that way, but what I’m getting from that you’re saying is that she shouldn’t be drawn with her eyes rolling back out of sheer agony simply because others have seen porn with women rolling their eyes back with a d*ck down their throat. I personally didn’t get the sense that sexualization was what the writer’s purpose in writing that piece of torture was, so why is the conclusion that the author is sexualizing it and not that the reader has seen enough porn to only have that perception of the author’s work?

I think I meant exactly what I meant, it's not just for the eyes rolling, but the situation as a whole. I've been trying to say multiple times that had those specific scenarios been given to a random person out of context and are requested to tell what's on their mind, I'm fairly certain more than half would assume it's pornography, even if they don't consume a tantamount of pornos and is your average Joe around the neighborhood.

My point is, the scenarios that the author has put the teenage girls into are so SPECIFIC and DISTINCT (like c'mon it's not like you get to see a person get tubes shoved down their throats while their belly swells everyday right????) that it's shouldn't be rare for a fair amount of people or a majority to think it's porn.

I personally think, instead of assuming that the reader is someone whose mind is sex-addled and addicted to porn, it's better to question just WHY did the author depicted such scenes? Like of all things, why did the girls specifically had to be done dirty like this for the story to achieve a "meaningful" revenge plot? Why specifically a pill expanding inside the stomach? Why the tube? Couldn't you use some other plot devices that can achieve about just the same results?

Exactly

Dude stop its disrespectful towards the author. Even if you thought 0.5% of it is sexual doesn’t mean everyone need to understand this as sexual.

Yes they’re exist they can find everyone and everything sexual that’s why there’s a lot of dj/ fan fictions but don’t do this here in the original works section it’s different. Make your own dj/fanfic and gather the people who’ll like it but not here.

This is a safe webtoon keep it that way. there’s might be someone innocent who’s here only to read straight manhwa, talk about fetish and sexuality in mature sections.

If you talk about fetish n sexual even someone nails, belts, glasses can become their object there’s no end to them. There’s nothing to be surprised.

???

I'm not trying to advocate or promote any type of fetishes/kinks. I'm trying to conduct a civilized discussion about topics regarding a certain controversy. What do you mean??

Also, "safe webtoon"? Let's be realistic here, you can just press the home button and see all types of pornos garbage filling the page here and there, I find it hilarious you'd think my comment taboo, while manhwa covers of boobs and butts are pasted all over the website

Perhaps you’re unaware of your own word? To me you sounded like “the author is weird for making that scenes that’s sooo porn because some bdsm out there did the same things” while the context are different one seeking pleasure from pain and the others is pure revenge. Even if they’re drooling,tearing up, whimpering, with bloated belly, tied up it’s not the same. Sure you can fantasize about them but keep it for yourself.

Yes keep it safe, innocent here meaning someone who never thought anything weird about this manhwa, if I read normal manhwa I expect normal conversation when I read mature I expect mature topics. they have their own place.╮(￣▽￣)╭

Certainly minority people who thought of that but they’re really truly small amounts, even people who love bdsm can differentiate these things easily. You don’t need to tell us. Readers here know adults stuff more that you think.

There’s more tube feeding manga/manhwa besides this one n I never seen them making sexual comments.

Real life doctor can shove a tube to your throat they doesn’t care your eyes rolling back or not. Surely they are some who find that sexual but will they openly said that? I guess not. Not in their right mind.

The why isn’t that complicated. If I have a list of things my characters went through and have to come up with ways to retaliate for revenge, that could be the best way for me to translate that. Wanting to confine the author’s ideas because someone can sexualize it in their mind is the wrong way to look at it. That’s where their creativity took them and that’s all there is to it. As far as I’m concerned, those kind of tubes are used by doctors needing to look inside you without cutting you open, and as far as you’re concerned, using that tube has a sexual connotation. Unless it’s been stated for a fact that the author likes to sexualize their work piece, the fact is the problem doesn’t come from the author’s, but from the reader’s perception.

OP and @-xx- are totally right.
You guys are weird. This very "discussion" (more like ganging up on the few ppl who can think logicaly and are right, thus notliked by idiots) is prove of it. If OP was wrong you guys wouldnt try so hard to disprove. (Talk abt brain fry)
There is literally a genre called "toture-porn" and this manga clearly is part of it. AND is not even the first manga to do that!....

It’s not because you say so that it’s proof of anything. The fact is some people read this and perceive it as sexualization and others read it and perceive it as torture. Those who perceive it as torture are therefore puzzled by the sexualization and question it. Those are the simple facts.

Stop interacting with them sweetheart, it’s useless. there’s nothing we can do if they’re getting wet and hard with some tube. Remember there’s types of people who can get hard in the most normal situations.

As someone who can differentiate these things we need to understand there’s someone who can’t and let them be.

Even a lovely doraemon got sexualization n have their own porn, so just let them(⌒▽⌒)

Yeah, I think that’ll be the last of it for me ╮(￣▽￣)╭

dawg where are you even getting your information from? this manga is about extreme torture, if something is shoved down your throat of course it’s going to guarantee a reaction. Manga about TORTURE isn’t even in the same league as the disgusting PORN FANTASIES you’re clearly stuck thinking about while reading this.

i love you ╥﹏╥

Wow, just wow. Did you really just stooped that low and degrade me as some sort of person with porn for brains and think that all of this must be making me hard just because I'm trying to make logical and sensible reasonings? Do you not realize what the hell you're doing right now? Shame on you.

More than 2 paragraphs explaining why I'm not "down bad" just because I've addressed potential sexualization of MINORS (regardless fictional or not) all dumbed down by you to "oHh iGnoRe tHem, tHey'rE pRobAbLy jAckIng oFf to tHis" is literally so disrespectful.

I'm done with trying to argue to airheads who simply will not open up their minds and are practically just shaming, berating and degrading people who have different perspectives than them. You can think of this as me retreating or defeated or whatever, just know that you guys were DEFINITELY in the wrong for shaming someone whose actively AGAINST sexualization as someone who "eNjoYs aNd iS proBaBly m*StuRbaTiNg tO tHeSe tOrTure sCeNeS eWwwww"

Indeed, if you exclude out the fact that you're unwilling to accept the fact that you're not just puzzled, but actively trying to destroy anyone who even speaks up about it and tries to properly address the issues. Oh but of course, it doesn't matter now anyways. I'm done being a keyboard warrior, just wanted to let OP know that your opinion are absolutely valid, and don't let anyone insult you are human and you have your own liberty of speech to voice out valid concerns

THANK YOU! FINALLY SOMEONE WHO'S ACTUALLY ACTING LIKE A SENSIBLE ADULT! I'm fed up of being ganged up by these kiddish users.

Whoever you are, bless your soul fellow stranger←(>▽<)ﾉ

wowww ladies I was not expecting all this interaction (⊙…⊙ )
I don’t really appreciate the accusations being thrown around by either side of the argument right now so I might delete the topic if it gets too serious, let’s keep this a place where we all RESPECTFULLY share our opinions :)

Everyone is booing you but you're right this is literally just fetish slop

They are trying to fry you for telling the truth and i say this as a pervert lmfao. I may not feel the scenes as sexual bcs im not into that but some ppl are clearly blind to how fetish art/story works.

Like... You are telling me a story made by some Korean dude where majority of characters are pretty minor high school girls doing immoral and unethical stuff is just some innocent webtoon abt revenge?

If that's so who do they think this story main target is? It's probably either ppl who love revenge stories or ppl who get off in seeing (mainly) women receiving karma, and in a fetish type of way.

It may not be porn, bcs it isn't, but are we forgetting how even kids shows got adult jokes and fetish material (consciously or unconsciously) and this story is clearly for +16 at least

To not talk abt them trying to gaslight you into being THE problematic person here lol

Unrelated but it's like >those parents who don't understand that when someone says to "not post their naked/eating/bathing or whatever photos of their kids online" it's for safety reasons and not bcs they see them as sexual