I really loved the concept of this manga, I loved the dynamic and everything, but then the...

If someone doesn’t want to have sex and the other person keeps pushing until they reluctantly say yes that is fucking rape. The other person won’t take no for an answer and consent given reluctantly or when the victim doesn’t have a way out is not fucking consent.

Okay listen. Maybe Oono doesnt think it was rape in the end. And now he likes Kure (despite him bullying him). But the reason I’m pointing out that it “LOOKS” like rape is because it is no matter how you look at it, the story was fetishizing the concept of rape. (Even the display of Oono being humiliated by a dominating Kure in the cover page) Sorry if my previous comments came off as condescending or assholish I didn’t mean it as a personal attack but you cannot excuse the fact that the author was using the commonly used tactic of having the seme bully dominate and have their way with the debatably uncomfortable and non consenting uke, and using the uke’s conveniently and spontaneously realized feelings a chapter after the fact to try and diminish the fact it was indeed toned to be rape; intending to romanticize the scene. I know there are probably far worst case scenarios in the real world but that doesn’t make this issue any less important, and the reason I have been so pushy is that this issue is something I have recently taken interest in and have wanted to become more aware of.
It looks like rape because us as an audience were supposed to find it arousing that it was portraying a yaoi-filtered version of rape and now we are blinded by Oonos feelings being haphazardly shoved in as a cover-up, and it blinds us of how dangerous actual relationships (especially in the real gay community) like that can be. Kure is a bully, and that scene whether Oono liked it or not, capitalizes on the fetishization of rape. If this happened in real life, and Oono was a real person (not a yaoi uke stereotype) he would have felt violated, and emotionally manipulated, and would in no way develop such sudden feelings for Kureshima who has done little but threaten and bully him.

-sorry for the paragraph, but i'd really appreciate if you'd read it- But it really didn't look explicitly like rape to me, if you look back i've been arguing whether or not it was rape since even before ch 4 came out. I have a lot of people saying Oono was "crying and screaming", which is literally just innacurate. Oono wasn't crying, he had tears in his eyes and was blushing... It looked like a typical horny face to me, what really made it seem like he was just horny was him saying so himself. "i'm starting to feel like that time". His body posture as well, he hunches forward, something typical of a guy with a boner. You guys are arguing that the visuals are explicitly rape and i don't agree. It looked to me like, at most, rather than rape it was just a case of a pushy guy talking a pushover into a sexual act, getting him horny and then sweeping him along into sex. That isn't rape. That is something that commonly happens everywhere. Whether he was uncomfortable during the beginning of masturbation or not, he AGREED to do it and then Kureshima helped him get past his nerves with the dirty talking. He got horny and was fine. These are thoughts i'd had even before ch 4, but the dialogue in ch 4 fits this perfectly, everything clicked. If your argument was "the author tried to portray the scene as rapey to appeal to a wider audience" then i can agree to that, but if your argument is that "it WAS rape, the scene looks like it", then i have to disagree because no matter how it looked we now have the emotional context we were lacking. Oono didn't just say "it felt good", he also said "i wanted to be touched by Kureshima". How is it debatable at this point that it actually WAS rape? If you want to say it LOOKED like rape, all right. I kinda disagree, i'd say that a more accurate description would be that it looked questionable, like a gray area, but okay. If you're arguing that it was rape based on looks, i'm talking about WITHIN the story, not the author's intentions, then no it factually wasn't as Oono says it wasn't.

Yeah, it's a good thing that situation and this one aren't the same. Obviously if the person "won't take no for an answer, then it's rape", that implies the other person is only asking as a formality and will go to any lengths to get what they want. Kureshima was literally just going to leave, that's it. No force. Oono had and made a choice.

considering you read this word for word, the manga.
did you read this page? this one right here?
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/kajou_mousou_shounen/uu/m_chapter-3/pg-2/
i'm pretty positive, if my english isn't failing me, that reads "rape".

Honey, that was put there by the translator. They thought it was rape and too avoid whiners they put a warning.

Its there because it was perceived and it was supposed to be perceived as rape. I dont know what more evidence you need. Im not sure you read as I put in response. I know what Im saying and Im trying to carefully choose my words with intention.
Its Yaoi, its a popular bully/unpopular wimp trope with a rape scene covered up by "feelings" the author thought the feelings would be implied rather than trying to develop them before the "sex scene" thus making the scene to be percieved as a rape scene. (and this is different from a one night stand dont use that as a counter) all of the evidence u used were minute unintentional factors, or only used to cover up the fact it was rape.

I disagree and you're saying that my arguments are invalid based on nothing. "nuh-uh", that's what you just said. I'm basing what i'm saying on dialogue, the dialogue goes with everything i said. All the arguments you can bring forward are nulled by Oono's dialogue at the end of ch 4. This is because you're only basing what you're saying on visuals that came BEFORE the dialogue that expanded on that scene. You're ignoring the emotional context there that Oono gave us at the end. If you refuse to see this, then it isn't my problem. You're factually wrong. Oono says himself that he wanted it. Again, if you want to argue that the scene was purposely portrayed in a vague way, that's fine, but the "vagueness" there was Oono's emotions on what was happening. Oono just told us his emotions. If he says otherwise in future chapters i'll admit i'm wrong.

That SFX doesn't translate to "nooo!", check it up, i did. You DO realize that the translators are just normal people, right? Like, i've seen fans on mangago pick up translations... Literally anyone who knows how can do it... Their interpretation of the text and what SFX they choose to put in there while they were translating affects how the text is perceived.

Read this very closely.
Im not ignoring anything that you have pointed out. I addressed Oonos feelings as a cheap cover up device. And you did not address the rape disclaimer or rape scene with any more grace or evidence than I did with some of my evidence. Its almost a fallacy of assuming they just put it as something to shut ¨people like me¨ up and has the same likelihood of being put up to ward off those who might have been uncomfortable with the subject matter.
Obviously there will never be any convincing you, because I know the rape will never be addressed as rape in the future because it was only implemented to romanticize the concept as a plot device not actually address it as serious subject matter.
You are still arguing only that is not rape, when i am just trying to say it is fetishizing it with how it was planned out. I am not factually wrong, the visual and compositional aspects are just as, if not even more, important than the dialouge especially in primarily visual medium. I already laid out all of the evidence I need and I´m not going to keep repeating myself in a useless cat and mouse game. I dont need you to recognize it was rape in the story, but i need you to recognize obvious fetishization.
This is a cats game of a debate and Im not going to be arguing with the unconvicible any further.

I think i might have misunderstood you. If you're saying the scene was portrayed in a way that could be seen as rape on purpose, then i agree actually. I've already said that. The reason i "keep arguing it wasn't rape" is because we don't disagree on that point. We disagree on whether or not it was rape. I don't know if i've been clear, i'm not arguing that the scene wasn't purposely portrayed in a way that can be interpreted as rape, i'm arguing against using the LABEL "rape" as a descriptor for that scene since the "victim" explains he wanted it which implies consent. Wouldn't that be "dub-con" rather than "rape"? To label a scene as explicitly "rape" there has to be no doubts it was rape, right? It either is or isn't rape. Since this gives a very vague rapey feeling before brushing it off as just denial, i.e. the "victim" says it wasn't rape, isn't it just "dub-con"? Maybe we're arguing the same thing? Honestly, the rape warning and SFX are EXTREMELY weak evidence to label that scene as "rape"as the warning isn't part of the manga and the SFX was translated and can be misconstrued. Lets say the SFX DOES say "nooo", though i honestly don't think it does, why does that "no" automatically translate to "i don't want this" to you? Look at the page (29), assuming it DOES say "no", he would be saying "no" while being penetrated. He doesn't say "no" to any questions asked. Again, he would be saying "no" while being penetrated. Think about that context, if someone is mid-sex and says no during the penetration, don't you think that would seem more like a moan than a protest? The same way people yell "yes" while being penetrated. When people yell "yes", do you assume they're saying "i want this sex"? Or just that they're letting out a moan? People use both "yes" and "no" interchangeably in this context. Some people moan "no", some "yes". Why jump to the conclusion that the "no" here, which fits that context, is a protest rather than a moan? Also, if it WAS a protest, why ONLY say "no"? Why not "no, stop" or "i don't want this"? Why ONLY say "no" that ONE time WHILE being penetrated? If it was a protest to the sex don't you think he'd have KEPT protesting? If you look at the beginning of ch 4 it shows Kureshima holding up Oono's leg and fucking him, which means he let Kureshima fuck him long enough to change positions after that. Why'd he only kick him off AFTER letting Kureshima fuck him for a while.

When people yell "yes", do you assume they're saying "i want this sex"?
uuuummmm, that's the very definition of consent. "yes". yes means yes.
no means no. it's not a moan. it's no.