Lesbi_Honest's Topics (291)

Same

I also want to know

They're referring to the latest raw chapter. It hasn't been translated yet

Oh sHIt

Ohhhhh thx!!!

I'm sorry but I agree with your friend with the bit of shipping Ciel and Sebastian, from both a fan perspective and a being me,

As a fan I have read Black Butler as well as watching the anime and the movies, I get people to ship them because of all the bait, and 'it was originally supposed to be a yaoi', ya as someone who also likes yaoi I get that, it so cute and 'sexy' per say, but reading of Ciel's history I really don't ship him with anyone even Sebastian, I see him as more a parental figure in Ciel's life, and that's how their duo is represented, in my perspective, they both depend on each other, and I
feel more for the comedy and soft side for Sebastian and I don't think Sebastian would even go for someone who has been abused and so young, Sebastian takes on the carer role as that's what Ciel needs an adult who would care for him in the place of his parents, Ciel has been sexually abused by older men and it feels disgusted as a hardcore fan of Black Butler to ship him with Sebastian, I know Sebastian takes care for him, but still I can't help but pull a face when they are being romanticised,
its been a good few years, 5 I say, so my opinion developed overtime and with the story..
But I Don't judge, shipping them as only fictional characters,
Because I also ship older characters with younger characters,


Myself, I don't as well, the story is not set recently of course but in 1880, do some history and research the consent age in the UK is 16, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_consent_reform_in_the_United_Kingdom

it feels wrong to ship someone who is 13 and someone who is over centuries years old,

It depends on how you ship them, I like them mutually but if you ship them sexually with the reasoning of that they are fictional characters people can judge you,

Sorry for getting in your rant but I have very strong opinions for the ship 'sebciel'

(⌒▽⌒), again it's my own opinions, so let's not argue, i got ur point of reasoning, also Eren is 19 now? So go a head ship EriLevi all you want people!

The age of consent in the black butler time period was 13, but I can agree with some of your points with not shipping them, and it's your choice, but I'm saying about how she said you can't ship them in 2019 bc it's paedophilia, even tho they are fictional characters. I do agree and understand how you ship them tho, but I still love the ship and it is one of my otps and as is Ereri, but Eren is also 15 in the anime. There was also no consent in 860.

of course, but I must counteract with the fact that no it was still 16, as 1885 the law changed to 16, and so it would apply to Ciel, and 1886 he makes the contract with Sebastian so it would most definitely apply

I don't ship them sorry~

and the German consent age of today is 14, idk how it's weird, so I guess if you apply the consent age of today, nah its not wrong its legal!

im shook, Germany its 2019, consent shouldnt be 14 years old!

You're probably right. I always thought it was 13 but I'm stupid so idk. But seriously?!? 14?? I'm almost 14 and I don't even know how to make Mac cheese by myself let alone give consent to shit. Dang

im shook sis too, which 14 has the right mind to give so consent, bruh, we need to make this a big issue sis ╥﹏╥

Oww it has something to do to the author's work. Yana Toboso use to publish yaoi and shota under the pen name Yanao Rocks idk if you can find the one shot with six different stories (Glamorous Lips) you can see a lot of similarities in kuroshitsuji thats why it is always fine for the fans to ship ciel and sebastian in the first place.

yea, I know, Yana Toboso is known for her yaoi, and you can the yaoi elements in her works. and I can understand that,

I agree

Personally, I think there's a bit of a disconnect between the Japanese and the Western audience that gets lost in translation. A lot of the misconceptions happen because people are not familiar with the genre and who the creators/readers are.
I'm just going to point out that it's unfair to assume that Japanese people are "sexualizing" gay people. In the first place, yaoi as a genre is more of a western conception because in Japan, they don't actually use the term yaoi to describe the genre, but they instead use BL (Boys love) which includes a lot of LGBT+ content with works ranging for general audiences and for those over 18. Yaoi as a term was actually used by Japanese BL readers to poke fun of BL tropes; when you translate yaoi into English, it means "no climax, no point, no meaning." So yeah, Japanese people are aware of "problematic" material and are not just reading content uncritically. But even then, in actuality, a lot of gay men in Japan find BL to be "too romantic" for porn. No joke. There's a more hardcore genre written and read by male creators that features a lot of taboos that I'm not going to mention. So, about the idea that they're being sexualized...gay men are also writing porn about gay men unsurprisingly. xD
But even for "yaoi" (as understood by westerners), there are male creators too. It's just that western readers don't suspects it, so they just assume that only women write BL. For example, there's Hirotaka Kisaragi who wrote Brother x Brother, Haiji Sakura who wrote Abareru Inu, and Kujou Aoi who wrote Heart Stop. All male mangakas creating in the early 2000s with works featuring gay sex, prostitution, and so on and so forth. If your friend wants to tell those male mangakas that they're sexualizing themselves, then that's her prerogative I suppose. ^^;
As for shipping, I've noticed that shipping has some different cultural differences. In Japan, there's a strict line drawn between fiction and reality. Fiction is supposed to stay in fiction, and reality is supposed to stay in reality. Even Japanese cosplayers won't pretend to be the characters they're cosplaying- at least not to the extent to Western cosplayers. In fact, in more western spaces, you see accounts role-playing as characters, people "adopting" characters and acting as "proud mothers/fathers," people making self inserts to participate in that universe, and so on. It's actually a really weird thing to watch. So it's no surprise that a lot of Western shippers take ships more seriously and see them as "relationship goals" for real life and debating the virtues and/or vices of having a particular favorite ship. That doesn't really happen in Japan where characters remain in a fictional space where anything can happen and anything goes.
With that said, I'm not really here to argue for argument sake (and I don't want you to feel obligated to pass this to your friend to "convince" her of anything). So personally, I'm going to keep moving on and reading LBGT+ works, and I don't want you or anyone to feel that you're "sexualizing" any one for reading fiction. Treating people with respect in real life is more important.