Power, Responcibility and Consequences

Anoni Grrl December 4, 2015 7:23 pm

What do you all think would happen if Asami turned his back on the underworld and turned to strictly legal and moral business actions from now on? Do you think "warfare" would erupt from all those who want to step up and fill his shoes? Would whomever won likely be kinder or wiser than Asami? Would the Japanese underworld accept Fei or Mikhail as foreign leaders of their enterprise? Would Aron's employer do a better job? Would anyone be strong enough to actually end crime and the black market in Japan?

I think it can be argued that Asami serves the greater good by remaining in power, even if it means he lives in darkness. Here are my reasons:

*Asami is competent and reasonable. He does not act cruelly or capriciously. He does what is necessary, but he is not a sociopath.

*Even legal business involves competition and hard decisions to maximize profit, so legal does not mean good.

*Asami works with the government, even if part of what he does is illegal. To me, this indicates the government finds him useful in some way (though the government is also somewhat corrupt).

*If Asami were not in charge, there would be more chaos until someone else took over.

*When someone else takes over, he or she may be worse than Asami, so more people would ultimately suffer.


When you look at it this way, it is almost as if Asami has a duty to continue running things, even if that means he is dark. What do you think?

Responses
    Anonymous December 7, 2015 12:38 am
    1) I don't think Asami created a "monster" in Fei. I think Fei is a promising if immature leader of a difficult group, and he has always lived in a kill or be killed world. I think Fei has a way to go to be up ... Anoni Grrl

    Asami absolutely created a monster in Feilong. Everything Fei did from the point Tou shot him until those last moments on the boat was driven by feelings of revenge against Asami. Asami himself acknowledges this, even if you don't.

    Of course, Fei's feelings are personal. That doesn't stop them from influencing the way he operates. It would be nice if everyone behaved like a grownup but that doesn't always happen. Asami picked the wrong guy to toy with and by so doing, indirectly destablized an entire criminal organization, which came back to bite him in the form of Fei's turncoats, who took Aki.

    Asami wanted to play kingmaker with Baishe. He didn't have to stick his nose in there, but he did and he screwed it up. If he'd done it right, he would have had an ally in Feilong and none of this would have happened.

    Costs absolutely matter. Yoh was a resource that was spent not in pursuit of a goal but to clean up a mess. That was a loss, not a calculated expenditure to achieve a planned goal. And to talk about what happened to Aki in terms of costs is pretty cold.

    Aki did not leave the hotel room. He was left there, drugged by Asami--another thing Asami acknowledges was a mistake. That's why Aki was still there when Fei's men broke in and beat him into telling them where Asami had gone. That's on Asami.

    Yes, it was stupid for Aki to go after Fei in the garage but Fei took him because of Asami.

    Asami was a step behind numerous times. He failed to guess that Fei would tail Chou to Tokyo. Failed to realize it was a mistake to leave Aki behind, alone and drugged in the hotel. Went alone without backup into the situation with Fei holding Aki at the garage. Took a long time to catch up to a quickly changing situation on the boat. That was taken out of his hands and he could really only react as it played out. The point there being that he is not always in control. He is not always able to keep up with events in his world. Even to where the story stands now. He knew Sudou was diddling him and he let it go until Sudou nearly killed Aki. And he left Sudou alive to where he might become a pawn to be used by Mikhail. He's not perfect. He makes mistakes. A lot of them.

    Again, whether or not Mikhail achieved any goals doesn't change the mistakes Asami made. And it is by no means a given that Aki's job as an investigative photographer would have seen him kidnapped and raped by Chinese mobsters.

    Anonymous December 7, 2015 12:43 am
    I am not sure where you get "benevolent" from. I am saying he is competent, and that he is logical and not cruel for the hell of it. When Asami is cruel, it's for a good reason: to achieve a goal. The fact that... Anoni Grrl

    How does Asami seem to enjoy his role? We know he's a workaholic but I don't see him taking immense pleasure from being a crime lord. Not to the point where he would prefer to die in the saddle. So to say it is wussing out because it might be leaving behind something he enjoys is pure speculation. We simply do not get enough of Asami's point of view to make that leap.

    And no, I do not mean Aki by "I got mine." I never brought Aki into this. You did. I mean money. He could walk away with plenty. And I never said he could or should walk away now. At some point, yes. And my original point was that if he is as smart as you and his character sheet claim he is, he would have made a plan against that day.

    Anonymous December 7, 2015 12:52 am
    What unnecessary drama have to do with the deed? Why did Mikhail goad Yuri about Aki? What was the point of setting up Yuri to attack Aki (which is exactly what Mikhail did). Where is the benefit to Mikhail in... Anoni Grrl

    I'm not interested in defending Mikhail as I never put him forward as a possible successor, so he isn't part of my argument. However, I do not agree that he deliberately set up Yuri to attack Aki. And that isn't a defense of him or his behavior. I think he was idly twitting Yuri because that's just who he is. He invited Yuri to "try him out" as a joke. I don't believe he felt that left Aki with Yuri, wanting, expecting or even suspecting Yuri would try to kill Aki, not when Aki was his chess piece. And he didn't goad Asami that much. If Feilong needs to control his feelings like a grownup, then why is it on Mikhail for stirring up Asami? You can't have it both ways.

    Anoni Grrl December 7, 2015 2:12 am
    Asami absolutely created a monster in Feilong. Everything Fei did from the point Tou shot him until those last moments on the boat was driven by feelings of revenge against Asami. Asami himself acknowledges thi... @Anonymous

    First, I don't think Fei is a monster. Second, Fei's feelings and how he chooses to deal with them are up to Fei. Fei's feelings of obsession (or if you prefer revenge) are on Fei. Fei's choices and actions are on Fei. Asami didn't toy with Fei. Asami pursued a goal with respect to leadership in the Baishe. Fei is a much better leader than his "brother" would have been.

    Asami did good there, even if Fei didn't understand it. Asami didn't screw up. Asami accomplished his goal. Asami may make some comments when he is feeling guilty about Aki being hurt, but that is just what people do. Objectively, Asami got the job done. Fei is in charge, as he should be.

    You are correct about the hotel room. Asasmi should have had guard on Aki. I momentarily forgot that. But one mistake doesn't make Asami a bad leader (or destroy my argument). Technically Aki isn't part of Asami's group, and if Fei were not so obsessed with Asami, Fei would have no reason to go after Aki. From the point of view of someone in Asami's rank and file, who cares if Aki was taken? It has nothing to do with the group.

    Aki would have gotten into trouble regardless of Asami because of Aki's job and his nature. Aki would have taken that MO, and that would have gotten him picked up. Now, Fei made some choices because of Fei's illogical and unreasonable feelings, but that isn't on Asami. That's Fei's choice. Fei is responsible for his own actions.

    Asami doesn't control everything and everyone, and he is not omniscient. But Asami still acts logically, with a strategy. There are times when you can describe him as 'behind' but he is not merely reacting blindly. Asami has a plan. It doesn't always go right, but Asami has a strategy--and he wins at the end.

    Asami had plans to deal with Sudou too. Asami let it go on purpose because he had some plan with Kuroda and wanted to find out more about other people dealing with Sudou. It was a strategy, not a failure. Sudou made himself into bait.

    Aki volunteered to get involved, and Aki almost got Aki killed (no one will ever convince me it was not stupid to take that drink). Asami showed up to save his ass. Again.

    Leaving Sudou behind for Mikhail or whomever was like leaving trash on the curb. Sudou can't hurt Asami. The fact that Sakasaki went garbage picking for the Russians doesn't make it an error to have just thrown that worthless Sudou away. Sudou doesn't matter. He is nothing.

    When I pose the question of what good Asami does as a leader, I am looking at his overall effect as the head of a group (or maybe as a leader within a group). Just because everyone is imperfect doesn't mean everyone's skills are equal. Even among imperfect people, some leaders are more effective than others. I would rather a logical, orderly, and competent imperfect leader be in charge than a nasty SOB who can't get the same results.

    I am not saying Asami is always in control, or that Asami is perfect. I am saying that Asami is a competent leader, and that those are rare. In fact, so rare that it would be hard to find a character who could do as good a job as Asami does. I am not judging Asami as a person or a lover. I am looking at his affect on the organization he leads and those who are affected by that organization.

    From the point of view of someone in Asami's ranks, or someone dealing with Asami's underlings, does it matter if Aki gets hurt because Fei has a thing for Asami? No. it has nothing to do with Asami as a leader.

    Anoni Grrl December 7, 2015 2:38 am
    How does Asami seem to enjoy his role? We know he's a workaholic but I don't see him taking immense pleasure from being a crime lord. Not to the point where he would prefer to die in the saddle. So to say it is... @Anonymous

    The reasons I think Asami cares more about leadership than he does about money is that

    (1) Yes, he is a workaholic. Why would he do that if it wasn't important to him?

    (2) Asami uses money as a tool rather than treating it as a goal. Consider the fact that the decor in Asami's penthouse all belongs to the former owner, and that Asami tells Aki that Aki can redecorate. Asami uses money to buy things to promote a certain image. Asami uses money to make people happy (when Asami likes that person) such as when Asami orders special fireworks or obtains a rare edition of a book. Asami doesn't use money to indulge himself overly much. Where are the things Asami loves in that penthouse? There are those guns, and the S & M equipment, but not a lot of material wealth that seems to matter to him.

    (3) "Enjoys" might not be the right would to describe why I think Asami is a leader. It's more that it seems to be important to him. Maybe leadership is also a means to an end and Asamni has goals I do not know about. At this point, abandoning leadership would involve abandoning whatever reason Asami sought leadership for. That's quitting without achieving the goal and giving up on everything he has worked for. I may not know exactly what Asami is working for, but I know it must mean something to him to make him so driven.

    I don't have a "character sheet", but if Asami were thinking of retiring, I agree he probably would have a plan. Asami seems to be a guy who thinks things through and goes after his goals. Asami may not be Moriarty, but he is not Aki either. Simply arranging a successor would not change the fact that it might be better if Asami stayed where he is--especially since there is no good reason for Asami to leave now.

    What I am saying is that Asami is a competent leader, and that people are better off with him in power rather than they are without him.

    Imagine a universe where Hell is real and Satan rules over hoards of demons. One day, Satan says, "F*ck this. I'm going to some nice island and getting myself one of those fruity drinks with an umbrella in it." The Old Liar then leaves Hell to its own devices. Chaos ensues. Demons start warring and rampaging over earth. Damned souls start returning to pester the living. Eventually, the angels get tired of the noise and Michael hunts down old Lucifer to try to make Lucifer take back the reins. Does this mean Satan is a nice guy? Does it mean Satan controls everything? Does it mean Satan is perfect? Of course not. It merely means Satan does a good enough job that having him in charge is better than having him gone.

    I am not saying Asami is Satan. I am saying Asami is good enough at his job that having him there is better than not having him there.

    Anoni Grrl December 7, 2015 3:03 am
    I'm not interested in defending Mikhail as I never put him forward as a possible successor, so he isn't part of my argument. However, I do not agree that he deliberately set up Yuri to attack Aki. And that isn'... @Anonymous

    I don't know which anon first suggested Mikhail as a successor. It's hard for me to tell one anon from another. However, the difference I am trying to establish is in the reason why people do things. Asami is responsible for Asami's actions. But Asami is not a prick for the joy of being a prick.

    Mikhail didn't make Asami shoot, but Mikhail was prick for no particular reason. Mikhail is a prick even when there is not profit in being a prick. Mikhail is a prick for the pure joy of being a prick.

    Mikhail's conversation later implies that he personally had been scared by Yuri (someone in Mikhail's group who didn't accept his own desire). Having been scarred himself, Mikhail should know what effect baring Aki's beautiful bum would have on the self-hating Yuri. If Yuri would hurt Mikhail because Yuri hates Yuri's homosexual attractions, what would you think Yuri would do alone with bare-assed Aki? Yuri is responsible for Yuri's choices, but Mikhail was stirring up shit on purpose.

    Yeah, Mikhail was being a prick.

    dee December 7, 2015 8:14 pm

    it will be boring