blueninja89's Topics (640)

I dont think he necessarily hates him, just hates that he's inferior to him. like he said he has an inferiority complex that was "planted" by him. its like your significant other cheated on you so you hate on the person they cheated on you with but its not necessarily that you hate the person but you just hate that your lover cheated on you with them so you push that on to them instead of blaming your lover, you blame it on them. he was mad that he was always second place and his parents took that out on him so hatred grew in him and he just blamed it on the reiji for his inferiority complex. sorry for the long as paragraph LOL.

also very thin line between hate and love, sometimes that line is blurry, cliche ik lmaooo

I agree, that question is a complete turn off when asked like that. "I won't make fun of you (because I'm such a good guy)"?? Is it something to normally make fun off, then, is what you mean? Then right back at you: "How many of your relationships lasted more than a month? It's ok to tell, I won't make fun of ya"

Also notice how it will go both ways. If you're having too much sex you're a hoe (unless you're a good looking man) and if you dont have any experience boo hoo you're a virgin. People will find anything to scorn about.

or even asexual. i have never seen an asexual man in a bl story and it's disappointing

and it's such a "banality" in the bl genre that people don't even refer to the characters as their name but as their role in bed. which is disgusting and fetishizing and sexualizing gay relationship. even in shounen ai they somehow ask "who's the seme and who's the uke" as if it's the most important thing about that story

You’re completely correct (how heteronormative the majority of BL is, how sex positions never change, how you don’t see verse/verse tops/verse bottoms), but don’t drag this work. Zumiya Zeniko is a lesbian who started out with Shoujo Ai/regular comedy and then got into shounen ai . I’ve never seen her be fetish-y towards rl mlm

If a member of the LGBT wants to write their story this way, so be it. It’s not their responsibility to write the most accurate/educational LGBT romance. It’s on the audience to never apply BL knowledge to real life mlm and to do LGBT research.

Also, as a high femme lesbian, I like GL/BL with clear defined roles, and I’m tired of being told I’m a disappointment for ‘liking heteronormative gay media, you’re not a real lesbian’.

In the end: yeah you’re right and I do wish to see a change in BL for the sake of rl mlm, but also don’t drag a work which was written by a LGBT member.

Thare is a man who is ace in "All about lust"
Hmmm... This statement itself is a tiny spoiler(￣∇￣")

And this is question i made before... Thare is recs and an article with tons of recs... Not only stories but thare is so much ship analysis and stuff like that... Its really interesting if you're wanna know more about ace people and stories.

https://www.mangago.zone/home/mangatopic/12253100/

I understand your point but thats ridiculous to claim that a member of the LGBT isn't allowed to be critiqued solely because they are a member of said minority. I may not agree with how the plot is written but I'm critiquing her work not the individual themself. Granted the fact that she may know better and choose to perpetuate stereotypes as you've said does come into play but is afterall her own personal business. As a lesbian as you said and not a gay man she's not directly impacted in her own writing and that does say something, additionally she's not writing for an audience known for its LGBT accuracy or even reader attendence. Would she apply this same level of stereotype writing a GL story given her personal background? That's a question we don't know. At the end of the day as you've said it's her work and her decisions, but please don't tie in an author's sexuality to excuse their work, just as an author is valid to write so are others to critique it. It's like if Caitlyn Jenner a transwoman but still showed homophobia or transphobia as she actually does and excused it because she's LGBT it's not fair to others in the community and insulting.

You are so right! I'm so sorry it's a sexually that is constantly overlooked and I even did it myself just now!

i'll have to read it

While I can sympathize with your frustrations with BL as a genre, I think you're being a little unfair to this work in particular.

"penetrative sex is not a requirement to have sex let alone to be in a gay relationship."

And what happens when - just a thought - one of the partners wants to have anal sex?
You say that there is no room for change or compromise, but Seichirou literally does just that when he volunteers to switch from seme to uke after Uta becomes anxious with the idea of bottoming, putting his lover's comfort over his own sexual desires. That's already a far cry from what happens in most BL, even more tame BL like Given doesn't do this. More often than not the seme just forces the uke into submission and they don't even bother discussing positions at all.
You say this is heteronormative, but I disagree. Seichirou has almost all the stereotypically seme characteristics: he's taller, more confident and composed, and is by far the more sexually aggressive of the two, and yet he's the uke? That's pretty subversive for most BL.

"Regardless of the reality of gay/bi men being bottoms, tops, verse, verse top, verse bottom, side"

But it's also the reality that many gay couples do have partners with exclusive top/bottom roles. I don't think that preference is any less valid to be in a gay relationship. And besides, we don' even know if they are exclusive, just that they have their preferences like any couple.

There is (￣∇￣)

There really isn't an issue nor are you wrong in how this couple can decide how they should sex based on what they feel comfortable with. The issue is the reason why one is bottoming is rooted in their partner's discomfort in the idea of anal sex in general and given the setting of Japan is likely rooted in masculine identity and a general Iack of sex education in sexual practices between mlm relationships. Seichirou obviously still wanted to top at some point but now as this is a BL and is often binary in it's expression of sex, Seichirou will FOREVER remain the bottom in their relationship despite the clear evidence he's doing so specifically because he would rather relieve Uta of any discomfort physically and emotionally. Realistically neither has been in a gay sexual relationship and neither has experience but now this experience will be locked in defining roles, that had we had Uta possibly doing his own research as well as instead of solely relying on Seichirou both boys could theoretically come to an arangement that didn't feel completely to the benefit of one partner.

We see this a lot in in BL when it concerns virginal characters or even one character has a preferred sexual position but completely changes to accomadate their partner's needs. Sexual compatibility never seems to be an issue in BL it's just someone rolls over for the other to just make the story work, despite many relationships requiring intimacy that each partner receives within that relationship that meets their personal needs wants or desires.

Sex isn't everything nor should it be but they do in fact have a sexual relationship that is a fact presented here. And it just gets annoying how unreleasatic that Seichirou is completely fine with the situation when he's a grown man who has shown an actual interest in not being a bottom but now for primarily the readers sake will be defined by his role as again BL conflates sexual position with characterization. One great example of a plot that actually properly breaks the mold is Neko x Neko. https://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/neko_x_neko/

So in conclusion I get your point of about preferences and such within gay sex but it doesn't apply here is what I'm saying. It's one person just making their partner happy and probably enjoys it now but that wasn't that they actually wanted from themselves is my point.

"how unreleasatic that Seichirou is completely fine with the situation when he's a grown man who has shown an actual interest in not being a bottom"
How is his indifferent change of mind unrealistic when it matches his pre-established blasé characterization? It fits perfectly well in my view.
And there is no evidence to assert that he was ever opposed to bottoming. At most, we could say that he desired to have sex with his partner and just assumed he'd top since he clearly takes the most initiative between the two?
Does it conform to a pattern within the genre? Maybe, sure. But it's not like it's just done just for the sake of convention as you assert, there's adequate justification for it based not on just being a naked trope, but based on characterisation that naturally flows into that decision.
You could say it's unrealistic, but how sure are you of that? Because we clearly do have real-world examples of gay men switching positions, sometimes even permanently, based on which partner they are with from sex surveys and academic studies.

"BL conflates sexual position with characterization."
In general? Sure. For this work in particular? No, in fact, it reverses it by having the naive and innocent virgin as the top.

" One great example of a plot that actually properly breaks the mold is Neko x Neko"
I've read it, and yes, while that manga does subvert some BL cliches, you must admit it absolutely wallows in others, no? For example the feminine character design, the infamous “I’m not gay it’s only you“ trope, and equating masculine appearance with being a seme. Remember, only when Keita matures into a "manly guy", i.e. when he assumes a " masculine identity" (to use your own words) and grows in stature and physique to match Satoshi, does he actually want to become a top. Pretty heteronormative right? And yet Kawa ni Sazanami doesn't conflate sex positions with stereotypical gendered roles. Again, as I've argued, by standard BL tropes Seichirou should be the top as he's coded more masculine, but he isn't and based on the raws he doesn't care either way. Seems bizarre to champion Neko x Neko whilst simultaneously belitteling Sazanami, not to mention how unfair it is to compare and criticize a small, 3-pages-per-chapter comic strip for not being as comprehensive and detailed as a 3 volume series with over 500 pages of content.

Look, I get it. If your argument was one of taste, i.e. "I personally prefered switch couples and feminine ukes", I wouldn't object. But it just seems unreasonable to criticise a work not based on its own merits, but because it doesn't cater to your tastes.