Erodesu-x's Topics (61)

yeah i fuckin knew what that link was and i clicked it any way u got me fuck

It scared me more than the clown did Σ( ￣□￣||)

Fuck me sideways.. It doesn't make any sense.
SPOILER
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Why is Akitora having sex with Rogi now? I swear I can't find in me any love for this couple, they make little to no sense together.

I'm the same as you .....the only thing between akitora and rogi is sexual tension and that's it .This couple is forced as far as i'm concerned i don't think rogi love akitora i think what he has is an obsession as for akitora the dude is a total jerk but I think he feel a great deal of attraction and fuck them both and all hail to the mother she is amazing you know a couple in BL isn't a meant to be when you prefer the female character and that's saying a lot . F*ck rogi and akitora and their forced romance .

I feel they are forced too. I actually think Akitora has better chemistry with Asoda. I still think he married and had a son just for the sake of his yakuza family, but still: that sex scene is really out of the blue.

So he really fucked nearly half the family. H..holy shit. This guy..does the dad and later does the son as well. I am speechless. I feel like I need a shower..in acid. I..I have no words. Just...(╯°Д °)╯╧╧

That's true if he were with asoda that will be less wtf i guess .More than that I think he is a man who you can't help loving being attracted to but at the same time he is someone who can't really love anybody .Still fuck these guys

I agree, haha. But it was in the past afterall. In Tatsuyuki's story, it was hinted that Akitora is now avoiding Rogi, which is why Rogi resorts to blackmailing/raping Tatsuyuki - His son. This avoidance may hint that something went down after the sex scene or even further down the timeline when it was hinted that Tatsuyuki's mom had died when Tatsuyuki was age 7 ╮(￣▽￣)╭

Taking the timelines into consideration, it is very likely that Rogi will end up with the guy who tried to con him with the car prank/death. Then again, Sensei my blindside us all by revealing some juicy info that changes the game ;D

I mean, I like the story. But this is chapter what, 6? And they already fuck? WHY? Does Akitora think Rogi is attractive and smart? Is he doing it just to mess with him? Is he in love?! I don't get iiiiit!!!! Till now to me it looked just like Rogi had this absurd obsession with Akitora but now Akitora has just like validated this obsession by fucking him, which will lead toward disaster, and it seems stupid Akitora doesn't foresee this. So maybe he has further motives? I really don't see any other explanation. I get that Beriko-san is in fucking love with her Rogi character, but I really am not getting why a lot of people love him. He's like a budget Yashiro and the story is getting more and more confusing @_@! I still like it though, but I feel I have to vent, maybe because my main ship (AsodaXAkitora) went south, LOL!

I don't wanna judge any of them, esp Akitora, without the full chapter yet. But it seems Akitora was hurt and my guess is that for some reason he saved Rogi from the old fat guy. Not that I am into cheating nor do I think that doing it with a guy is not considered as cheating but I bet they got into having sex because of the rush that happened prior to the scene from the spoilers. Like how it does in the movies where after escaping from a killer or monster, the characters suddenly find the time to have sex. This is also the same when couples fight then have sex after. There is definitely chemistry between them but I understand it's confusing where that is coming from since it's hard to understand these characters. Beriko writes them cryptically. I'm also still in the process of profiling Rogi and I kind of understand him more now (love him then, love him more now, sorry) but Akitora is in a whole another level. No idea how to even gauge him.

I think the story is about finding out who is Rogi through the past timeline, like flashback in a flashback, to find out why is Rogi so obsessed with Akitora. I'm guessing this sex is supposed to be a one time thing but because of Rogi's past, he couldn't let go of Akitora and then the story spirals down from there. I think this flashback is all important for Rogi to move on and open himself again for Hachi to enter his heart. As we read the flashback, Rogi in the present is remembering them at the same time, so I'm hoping by the time the flashback finishes, Rogi is also ready or in the process to accept new love. Heck this is supposed to be a 5 volume series.

I totally agree with you! I am hoping that whatever transpired between Akitora and Rogi will be revealed in depth at some point in the story (5 volumes, really?!). As Rogi is still clearly hung-up with Akitora, as depicted in Tatsuyuki's story, it would be great to see him reflect/rectify/accept what happened in the past (unless past happenings are still going to affect the present/future happenings). I'm looking forward to learning more about Hachi too!

I asked NijiNiji already and the plan is to make it into 5 volumes. Well it still just a plan, it may still change but I think it's worth expanding the story since Rogi is such a complicated character and so is Akitora. We're barely touching what makes Rogi who he is to make sense of his actions. We don't even know who Akitora really is. So far, all I can make out about Rogi is that his intelligence lead him into having twisted values, which ends him being misunderstood and of course, alone, and Akitora is the only one who can follow his jam. And this is why maybe Rogi is so attached with Akitora. To think I only got that now and I have no idea what was happening in the previous chapters. So definitely there is still a lot to expand about this story before we actually get into the present timeline and actually fix everything.

Well it's not a one time thing because if you remember the first pages of chapter one we can see them having sex (now I have no doubt it's them since Akitora seems to have no problem having sex with Rogi).

It could be just Rogi's fantasy but of course it may also be not. Rogi has mentioned that he fantasizes Akitora while doing the old guy. Also, I still think it was supposed to be a one time stand but maybe (since we still don't know) things just gotten out of hand and it happened multiple times. I'm not surprised anymore, really, yet by no means I am okay with it, since it seems having an extramarital affair with a gay/transgender is quite common, apparently. (I just watched JefferyStar's video saying it is.) But of course, the time period this is happening in the story is in the 90's (right?) and in Japan so I doubt this act is acceptable. I feel bad for the wife but I do think this is why Akitora is staying away from Rogi. I just can't hate the characters anymore since I'm looking forward for the present timeline. We're just being shown the mistakes these characters have made in the past.

I think it's the 80s actually. But really, it doesn't matter, I just didn't expect Akitora to be so attracted to Rogi though it's my mistake, I should have known after seeing the covers and merchandising Beriko designed for them ^^". I... still am curious about Asoda role in this, because what made me slash Asoda and Akitora in the first place was the fact that the author shows us a lot of reactions Asoda has whenever he talks about Rogi to Akitora (those long troubled looks, LOL). I always thought Asoda knew that Akitora marriage wasn't out of love (because come on, now nobody can tell me Akitora loves his wife when is doing lewd things with Rogi, LOL) and feared that Akitora could be attracted by Rogi and being extremely worried about it. I'm really curious to see Asoda reaction when he finds out what's happening. As far as the present story, my little love for Rogi and the fact that I know less than nothing about Hachi doesn't make me so curious about their development, I'm more focused on the past ^^".

I have no idea what made Akitora attracted to Rogi either. Interested, yes, Rogi's behavior with death the first time they met and still sane (or insane) to ask for pleasure is twisted yet interesting enough, but attracted, I, too, still have no answer to that. I have with Rogi to Akitora, though, and so I understand. I can't say much for Asoda. He's a character outside the situation so he can see everything; thus, he can worry about everything.

I have to disagree with Akitora not loving his wife simply because he entertains Rogi, though. It is not clear whether Akitora does love his wife or simply obligated to their marriage but Rogi has nothing to do with it. Be it that he loves her or not, what he has with Rogi, SO FAR, is simply physical. Sex and love can be separated for most (or some) people. Their lust and physical needs and to whom they do it with is different with their emotional security and affection and to whom they share that feeling or emotion with. Maybe there will be a time where Akitora truly fell for Rogi and fell OUT of love for his wife, OR NOT. There are different possibilities but I'll leave that to Beriko how she'll take the story further.

Also, the story is written in Rogi's perspective and so are the covers and merchandise, whether they did have a romantic relationship or not. Just my gut feel, though.

Sorry but I don't think the story is written in Rogi's perspective. I've just seen the complete scans of this new chapter and there's a lot of Asoda thoughts before the sex scene, and I'm curious as hell to know what they are. Also yes, Akitora can love his wife but I don't think he is "in love" with her, sorry it makes little sense but that's how I see it. The complete scans though make the chapter even colder that what could be perceived from the sex scene. Also, the wife finds out and seems cool about it? FFS this manga is so confusing, I swear the only one that gets the "jealousy" tag till now is Asoda!

By what I mean by Rogi's perspective is that it is Rogi's story and is centered about him. Other characters would have their own thoughts here and there but still the story centers on Rogi, and most would be on his perspective, and the story is told on his way/through him. Kinda hard to explain since I don't exactly know the right words to use but my experience with Saezuru is also the same. The story is in Yashiro's perspective but you get snippets of other's POV and monologues, too, yet always goes back to Yashiro.

I get the idea when you mean "in love" and I don't wanna conclude anything yet, really. Haha. But even if Akitora is "in love" or not, he can still fuck around and ravish someone else, sad truth. Or he's curious with men and homosexuality? Maybe. Then, fell in love with Rogi and some identity/orientation crisis happen in the middle of it. The choice between love and duty; Rogi and Wife (I forgot her name)+ Tatsuyuki + Yakuza. I'm already predicting, I'm hopeless.

Oh her being cool with it, isn't it in the recent chapter she mentioned that she is ready for anything Akitora does? Or something like that. He's always ahead of others and I'm assuming he can be weird at times. Weird includes "that" and she's prepared to it I guess. Dang, that woman is though. I believe Beriko is presenting characters with morals that are beyond normal or uncommon. Their logic is different so they are hard to understand and the story gets confusing. The only normal one among them is Asoda.

Is this some joke???? like are we being played???? like wtf? what the actual fuck???? i never felt this grossed out while reading a chapter. and the wife returned at the end imma vomit

I hope the wife will ask wtf went down there, if Akitora is he is fine with dude's now too,throw Rogi out of their house, packs her bags and leaves for a beautiful life outside these shits with her cute son - ok that won't happen, but i really wanna see her pissed, kick his ass and getting some answers. this just feels wrong, it's the 2nd time and she doesn't deserve this. I am really disppointed at Scarlet for romantizing and including cheating. It would've been better if Rogi never got what he truely desired but guess what took it only 6 chapters. Seriously....

Whilst I agree that cheating is bad, I think that Beriko has done an awesome job of portraying 'real-life' situations in the Yakuza world. I would not say she is romanticising cheating but just given a fairly accurate illustration of what happens not only in the Yakuza world, but in the real-world as well. You say that the wife does not deserve to be cheated on (I agree, no one deserves that), but many Yakuza men have mistresses (men included). The wife may not even be averse to the cheating. As suggested in an earlier comment, the wife may only be with Akitora out of obligation, not love. After all, no in-depth portrayal of love has been shown between the two. Because of this, I think it is too early to judge what is right or wrong with the current information we have about their relationships. I personally like Akitora's and Rogi's dynamics and think they have great chemistry (so far!). I do not however think that 'love' will be explicitly shown between Aki and Rogi. I think we will have to wait and see how the predicament in the latest chapter will unfurl!

Also if I may add to Erodesu-x's reply, one of the wife's admirable traits, if not the most admirable one, is that she is prepared and is very knowledgeable about the world that she got into. The scenario you are hoping for is more for a woman who is married to an ordinary salaryman or any other ordinary person. While our Head Lady is born and raised in the Yakuza world, if I'm not wrong on that. She knows very well how egotistic Yakuza men are and having a lot of affairs is part of how men measure and compete with their machismo. Akitora may pose as someone different from the usual Yakuza in the earlier chapters but she admitted that she is prepared for Akitora's whims because she knows how different he is. Also, based on the last panel of her in Ch 6, she was by no means angry but rather intrigued and challenged, compared to Rogi who was fuming with anger and jealousy. She might even have recognized Rogi in that expression of hers.

I don't see anything bad with Erie not wanting to be friends. But it's the same the other way around. If this isn't what they are looking for they should just say goodbye to each other. You're not obligated to date someone you want to be friends with nor you're obligated to be friends with someone you have feelings for.

Well the megane guy was the one who told him he'd try to date him. Irie only agreed and compensated to give him a time limit. Also theyre the ones who choose wether they can be friends or not and in irie's side, he didn't want to because just holding onto his feelings and being friends would only hurt him. Better break it up before getting hurt countlessly lol.

True. I didn't look at it from this perspective. However, I do feel like Irie is digging his own whole with the 'one month to fall in love' deal. They have only just met. Wouldn't it make more sense to be friends and then see where it goes from there? It just seems cowardly to me (￣∇￣"). It just seems that he is using this deal to save him from his own pain. It's painful not being loved back, I understand. But forcing your love on someone to achieve your own desired results is even more painful when the other party is not even aware of his own feelings yet because they barely know each other. He is expecting things despite knowing that megane-kun is neither gay nor knowledgeable of what Irie wants. But then again, megane-kun is doing the same. He is using this deal in order to stay friends with Irie despite knowing his feelings. I guess it is a two-way boat.

I agree, the megane guy is just forcing himself. How can Erie be happy with a kiss he forced. Now I didn't see it that way, the megane giving him hope when it may be hopeless. Let's see how the author plays her cards with this one, like this will be look like real love.

You're overlooking an entire scene of the manga. Irie didn't force megane to date him, nor did he say they can only be friends if they date. The part you're overlooking is the scene where Irie goes back to the cafe shortly after their first failed sexual encounter (ch 3, pg 5-15). What is actually said is that he has no intention of being friends with him, he even says, and i quote: "you know... I'm gay so do you even realize that we can't be friends anymore? (ch 2, pg 18). Meaning friends is out the window and as such there is no way he said "date me or we can't be friends" as you claim he said as some form of blackmail. As far as Irie forcing megane to date him, you can look back through the ch 3 scene and see that Irie was actually trying to say goodbye, it was megane who proposed they date out of desperation to stay together. Irie even refused to date at first, it isn't Irie who is controlling the relationship, it is megane as Irie makes the decision to date him against his better judgement, and i quote, because he "can't pull himself away from him" (ch 3, pg 4). He doesn't want to date a straight guy and even tries refusing, but his feelings win him over with megane's persistance. The one month time limit was him compromising for the seme because he likes him even though he's been burned by straight men in the past.

Ahhh, sorry but I was not trying to imply that Irie was forcing megane into a relationship. I've obviously perceived this differently from others. Why can't they be friends despite Irie being gay? Why does sexuality define whether or not they can be friends? Irie decided he likes him before they were even friends, that's where my confusion is coming from.

Furthermore, megane stated that he didn't want them to drift apart and that he himself was not so sure about love but was willing to find out together (Chap 3, Pg 7&8). Yet Irie is expecting kisses and sex on the first few days of 'dating' despite Irie acknowledging that fact that megane is straight but was willing to try his best. He also acknowledged that megane was not used to relationships (Chap 4, Pg 8) but still proceeded to mount him a few pages later?

I understand that whatever struggles Irie has had with love in the past have affected him. But it is a too way street. I would not say that megane is controlling or forcing Irie into a relationship either just because he cant pull himself away. It is not Megane's fault that Irie can not pull away. Even if he is persistent.

Honestly, I think I have lost myself in my confusion. However, I will rescind my statement on the blackmail as they are both making use of it as discussed with @Tolly. Furthermore I acknowledge the fact that unrequited love can hurt which is another reason to part ways after the one month deal.

But I still think that how Irie is sort of blaming Megane for is lack of sexual interest is unfair (Chap 4, Pg 7). He gets mad at Megane for not being all lovey-dovey. Well duh? You've only been going out for a couple of days? He is not gay? He is trying his best but does not know how? The communication between the both of them is really bad?

Maybe i'm just stupid (￣∇￣") It is interesting to see other people's perspectives on the matter but for me well ... I guess it is just a matter of perspective.

I'm not trying to start any disagreements btw (￣∇￣") it's just hard to see where other people are coming from.

It was a long response so i'll respond to specific sections, i'm also not really trying to be an ass so much as i am just trying to explain how i don't really get how you perceived their relationship the way you did(i hope that doesn't sound bitchy, i just didn't really know how to word it. : / ) Please read my novel, i put effort into it. ; )

"Ahh, sorry but i was not trying to imply that Irie is forcing megane into a relationship."---I'm sorry if i misunderstood what you were trying to get across, but what you were conveying is actually that you thought this way and it is a reason why i decided to respond, because i disagree. Here are some quotes from you that conveyed this point: "Irie is the rotten one using the blackmail of 'if you don't love me i'll never speak to you again'.", "Nothing better than a forced/almost reluctant pairing." and "forcing your own love on someone to achieve your own desired results is even more painful when the other party is not even aware of his own feelings."---can you see how, from these instances it seems that you're demonising Irie and how your use of the word "force" multiple times would lead me, or anyone really, to the conclusion that you feel as though Irie was forcing the relationship? I do see that you've recognized that megane is actually gaining out of this situation, but you've also stated you feel as though "it is a two way street" and i fail to see how. In what way does Irie benefit from reluctantly going out with megane? He was coerced into the deal by megane as shown in that scene. This is indisputable, he physically says bye and tries to leave only for megane to get persistant until he gave in. Megane got what he wanted, not Irie. Does Irie like megane? Yes, he says so himself. In this sense Irie gains a possible boyfriend out of the encounter. But HE made the decision to leave and megane overrode that decision. Irie decided himself that a "possibility" wasn't enough for him and that he didn't want to even try and see if megane could love him.

"Why can't they be friends just because Irie is gay?" and "Yet Irie is expecting kisses and sex on the first few days of 'dating' despite acknowledging that megane is straight, but willing to try his best."---I think you're misinterpreting what Irie meant by "we can't be friends, i'm gay.", don't you think he meant because he has feelings for him rather than that gays can't have guy friends? Seems like the logical leap to me. Irie is expecting sexual advances because they are dating, not trying to be friends. He didn't immediately hop on his dick, he tried to create a mood so that megane would make a move. You keep mentioning that megane is straight and that he is new to it all like he is doing Irie a favor by doing what he is, but as i've pointed out, megane asked for it. Irie already took everything you've been saying into account, as you've said yourself, Irie acknowledges that megane is straight and new to this. You know what decision he came to while taking everything into account? That he shouldn't do it. Which megane overrode. He knew that at best it'd be an uphill battle trying to get a straight guy to love him emotionally and sexually. Irie is compromising here, he didn't even want to try, and as Irie says, "now is the part where you're supposed to kiss me". They're DATING (i use caps for emphasis, not to be an ass btw), he expects a grownup dating experience, he is already compromising and isn't looking to be friends so why should he have to hold back? To cater to the guy he is already facing an uphill battle for? Also, Irie is wanting sex BECAUSE megane is straight, he doesn't think the arrangement between them is going to work out and hasn't from the start, hence him declining going out in the beginning. In his mind this is all going to end poorly like his other straight encounter.

"I would not say megane is controlling the relationship just because Irie 'can't pull away'"---I actually didn't say that, the reason i gave as evidence of this claim is that Irie said no and then megane pressured him into agreeing, Irie has been hesitant this entire time. As i said earlier in this response, megane got what he wanted while as Irie gave in, hence megane being in control. Think about it, can you name one way/scene in which things are going the way Irie wants them to? No, there isn't one. So why is he sticking around despite he reluctance to do so? Because megane asked him to. Who is it that has control over how quick their relationship progresses? Megane because he's straight and "has to get used to it". Irie stops trying to have sex with megane because he isn't ready during the mounting scene, meaning they will only do things, not just sex either, when megane is ready.

I think everything i've said here covers any other parts in your response that i haven't put quotes and --- around.

This was quite the story! Thank-you for taking the time to enlighten me with your response (not being sarcastic, it is just a ballache to type on my phone in the early hours of the morning, haha). Due to me being on my phone I can't give such a detailed reply but I will try my best (●'◡'●)ﾉ

Firstly, I do believe that I have illustrated in my earlier comments that Irie is forcing Megane into a relationship. I apologise for this. What I was implying is that the way the author has portrayed some of these scenes seems forced. At least to me the pairing seems forced. This may be intentional or I am perceiving it differently. After all, one story is different for each person reading it, right? Haha. Before the deal had been struck Irie was upset that Megane did not see him in the same way as he did. He kicked him out of the hotel for not feeling the same way (Hence why it seemed like Irie was forcing or projecting - for a better word - his feeling onto Megane) -> This is where I have obviously lost the plot and apparently don't even know what the hell i'm going on about any more (says myself to myself) ... ╮(￣▽￣)╭

I would not say Megane "overrode" or "pressured" Irie's decision to go out with him. He is an adult. He can choose to say no. No matter how much coercion there was (or wasn't at least to me). I'm sorry but I really cannot agree with you on this. I don't want to force the issue as this is just how I perceive it. I'm sorry! ╥﹏╥

I would not say Irie is compromising either. The story implies that he was expecting something out of it. He also stated in one of the chapters (Ch. 5 bar scene?) That he was trying his best to make Megane fall in love with him. To me this does not seem like a compromise but someone who is also wanting gains out of the deal. That is why he is sticking around. Megane also wanted gains out of the deal (I acknowledged this thanks to @Tolly). Irie wanted a relationship and Megane wanted to be friends (Before Megane started wanting to learn more i.e. call girl). Hence the two way street as they both gain something out of the deal even if temporarily. When I mentioned the blackmail I also rescinded it in an earlier comment, it just seemed that way with the deal. I also acknowledged that one of the reasons they could not be friends was due to Irie liking Megane. Fair game. It is hard to be friends with someone you are in love with.

Furthermore, didn't he stop mounting him during the sex scene because Megane was not looking at him? Lost his boner, maybe? There was no inkling that it was because he wanted to do things when Megane is ready. I get that he wants a grown-up dating experience but that is hard to achieve when the other party is inexperienced and obviously not on the same wavelength. In addition, Megane may be controlling how the relationship advances in sexual terms but if I was inexperienced and going out with someone, I damn well expect them to wait for my CONSENT before mounting me.

At this point I feel like Megane is like 'sorry if you were expecting something more but uhm?' I'm not saying Megane is in any way rejecting Irie's advances but he is not accepting them either. He apologises throughout the chapters when Irie gets the wrong idea. The one who is expecting the most is the one who is usually let down. Despite this he is still continuing with the deal because he wants to. He wants Megane to fall in love with him. I don't think he is doing it reluctantly or he would not be trying so hard to make it work.

(Monotone) haaaahahahah ... (￣∇￣"). Not as long or detailed as your response but at this point I think it is just a matter of perspective? I hope I have not come across in any bad way with my response? I'm not the best at expressing what I am trying to say.

Then don't read this kinda cliche story that has a forced pairing wtf just learn to scroll away if you don't like the characters

Woah, hold on. I just wanted to express my opinion like the other users were doing...

On the contrary, I find the characters interesting aside from the overused plotline...

How my posts have envoked such a nasty response from you I will never know.

You obviously have not understood what I was trying to illustrate with my posts. I was not trying to offend anyone or cause any arguments ... Disagreements were expected as my views are clearly within the minority with this manga.

If you don't like my opinions, 'scroll away.' But then again, I would not like that as I enjoy speaking with others about their outlook on the story. Whatever drove you to make this comment instead of scrolling away is in line with why I did not scroll away from this manga.

Maybe before making snide comments you should try to understand where the other person is coming from. Just because I find the story cliche (which is my own personal opinion), it does not mean I hate both the characters. I just could not understand the choices that were being made by them. The people of this thread have kindly let me know their opinions - without making any snide remarks - which has been a lot more helpful than merely 'scrolling away.'

Don't get all butt hurt because one persons views do not match up with your own. I ain't gonna drop the manga just because you said so. The whole point of the comments section is to comment on the manga. Which I did.

Don't worry, it's been established that we are just talking, so i wont assume anything you say is rude. I'll also be careful about my wording so as not to lead to misunderstandings. I'll respond to a few things in the same manner previously. If at any point you get tired of the topic, feel free and tell me, i'm not here to force you.

"Before the deal had been struck Irie had been upset that megane didn't see him in the same way that he did. He kicked Irie out of the hotel for not feeling the same way."---I didn't take that from that scene? From what i understood, didn't Irie kick him out because for -insert amount of time since we don't know how long they've known each other- megane has been giving off false signals on accident that would give any gay man hope? He doesn't just accidentally brush people, his accidents are inherently sexual in nature. Irie had gotten false signal after false signal until he was sure megane was interested too and then decided to make a move only to find out NOTHING is like he thought it was. This is actually a good point to bring up because you keep mentioning that you feel as though Irie is moving too fast with megane, but you have to keep in mind that they met well before the deal and Irie had basically already been dating megane before hand. He tried to "progress their relationship" by accompanying megane on his birthday. It seems to me that the false signals are the reason he kicks him out, i'm pretty sure he even talks about it in the scene where he kicks him out. He does make A decision based on megane not reciprocating, he chooses not to date him. Which he is coerced into.

"I do not believe megane 'overrode' or 'forced' Irie decision. Irie is an adult and can say no no matter how much coercion there was."---How do i say this? Coercion by definition involves force, meaning you don't feel like you have a choice, it isn't really a matter of being an adult. Irie made the decision to leave to which megane responded by begging him not to leave and then even boxing him in against the door, physically stopping him from leaving. This is by definition coercion and in extension force. Let me put the same exact happenings in another situation that might compare well, if you walk into a grocery store and consider buying a brand of cereal you don't like, you decide to leave it because you aren't sure you'll want it and then an employee comes up and says "No! Please don't go, you have to try this!", you politely decline and keep leaving only for the guy to follow you and trip, boxing you in against the side of the aisle begging you to take the cereal so you decide to take it. Would you also say "well, the customer was considering the cereal in the first place so it's not force"?

"I would not say that Irie is compromising either. The story implies that he was expecting something out of it. He also stated in one of the chapters (ch 5 bar scene?) that he was trying his best to make megane fall in love with him."---This is another one of those "how do i say this without sounding like an ass?" things. Here goes. You're bringing up Irie saying he's been trying to make megane fall in love with him in ch 5 and trying to use that as evidence that Irie is gaining out of the arrangement and in extension not being forced, but you're forgetting that the deal was made in ch 3. The deal, that was made in ch 3, was for Irie to date megane (megane's words: "please date me properly!") to which Irie decided to put a 1 month time limit on so that if things weren't going to work out he could leave. The deal was that they would date for 1 month and BOTH of them would try to work on megane falling in love with Irie. This is what dating is. So of course after making a deal in ch 3 to do just that, he talks about having done it in ch 5. Simple cause and effect. If you put bread in a toaster you don't get surprised when you get toast, right? : D

"Furthermore, didn't Irie stop mounting him during the sex scene because megane wasn't looking at him? Lost his boner, maybe? There is no inkling that he wants to do things when ready."---Yes, he stopped mounting megane because he wasn't looking at him, but the reason he stopped upon seeing him looking away is because he knew FROM megane looking away that he wasn't ready. This was confirmed seconds later in the scene when megane said "i'm really sorry, i was surprised so i couldn't do anything" (ch 4, pg 17). It literally says he wasn't ready.

"In addition, megane may be be controlling how their relationship advances in sexual terms, but if i was inexperienced and going out with someone i'd damn well expect them to wait for my CONSENT before mounting me."---They're DATING, you said it in the same sentence, "if we're going out". If you ask someone out and they say yes, you now have consent automatically to make sexual advances on them. He tried a sexual advance and when he noticed megane wasn't ready he backed off. Dating protocol 1o1. Or did you want him to say "hey, it's been a great evening and the movie was great, spending time with you has made me horny, may i please sit on your dick"?

I actually agree with you that Irie is staying in the deal of his own accord... NOW. He initially rejected him, it is only by like ch 5 and 6 that he starts actively enjoying himself. He had his guard up at first, hence me saying he gained nothing from the deal in ch 3 as he didn't start liking the situation till ch 5.

You're being rude. I'd advise trying to use words to express your opinion and facts to back them up. Who would you pay attention to, a 20 year old who says your opinions are stupid and calls you a cunt or a 20 year old who says "you know, i can understand why you think that way, it makes sense, but here is what i think and why."?

Once again, thanks for your time and patience! You really outdid yourself with this one and there's a lot that has been cleared up (⌒▽⌒) to make myself clear, I will respond in kind and elaborate how I perceived each of the comments you/I made (does this even make sense? ╥﹏╥). (Thanks for the examples by the way, they gave me a chuckle ;D)

"Irie had gotten false signal after false signal until he was sure megane was interested too and then decided to make a move only to find out NOTHING is like he thought it was." - Yes, I understand this now. "He doesn't just accidentally brush people, his accidents are inherently sexual in nature." - I'm interpreting this as you saying that DESPITE his actions being accidents and being most agreeably sexual in nature, the most logical thing to think is that megane is sending signals that he likes him also? This makes the most sense to me now, if I was receiving these signals if I liked someone then I would also think they like me back. I see why Irie kicked him out of the hotel now. Embarrassment at it finest I suppose? I just interpreted it as Irie being butthurt that megane did not like him in the way he saw fit (explained a little more in detail further on).

"you feel as though Irie is moving too fast with megane, but you have to keep in mind that they met well before the deal" - Again, also an agreeable point. They did know each other beforehand and in chapter 1 it does state (albeit in small text which I must have skipped over) that they had become friends after meeting. However, you state that "they met well before the deal and Irie had basically already been dating megane before hand." - This I have to disagree with. What is this 'basically dating' you speak of? Isn't this just Irie interpreting the relationship/situation as he likes? Yes I agree that megane's actions are misleading, but even with these misleading actions, it does not excuse Irie to interpret that they are dating and the status of their relationship one sidedly? How can two people date when one of the people involved is unaware of the others feelings? You also state that Irie tried to "progress their relationship" - which relationship? Friends to eventual lovers? Or Lovers to an even more intimate relationship? Megane is not even aware that there is a relationship passed friends at this point. In chapter 1 (Pg 14) just before or after they go to the movies, they are holding hands, correct? This is because megane fell and Irie decided to keep hold of his hand. Megane said "It'd be good if we could stay good friends forever." (Paraphrased). Not a second later Irie wonders if it is okay to think that megane likes him. For me when a person says they would like to stay friends forever, I do not assume that they must like me back. However, I do understand that when a person is in love with somebody, sometimes it just can't be helped to think this way. That is why Irie is apprehensive as he himself questions whether it is alright to assume whether megane likes him back. Unfortunately, if I was in this situation I feel like I would be the one at fault for assuming that megane likes me back. Yes his actions were suggestive, but in no way is it explicitly stated that megane likes him or is aware of what he is doing. Call me old fashioned but if you like me, tell me. You expect me to guess your feelings? I just feel bad for megane because he was unaware of the feelings Irie had for him and then all of a sudden they are at a hotel with Irie and his ulterior motives.

Speaking of the hotel scene, (Ch 2, Pg 11) Irie says (paraphrased) "so everything was an accident and I misunderstood" To which megane replied with "Yes" - Do you see where I am coming from now with my view on the one sided interpretation of the relationship. I am not implicitly blaming Irie for thinking that megane likes him. Afterall, his actions were suggestive. However, Megane is not at fault for Irie believing that he liked him also. The actions of one cannot be blamed on the other (And i know you are not pointing blame :)) but to me it SEEMED (emphasis needed) that Irie was pointing blame at megane for essentially leading him on with his unconscious actions. Megane was not trying to do this, he even apologised. Irie then proceeded to kick him out of the hotel with the parting words of "Are you trying to make fun of gay people?" Once again, Irie is just assuming things to suit his needs.

"Coercion by definition involves force, meaning you don't feel like you have a choice, it isn't really a matter of being an adult. Irie made the decision to leave to which megane responded by begging him not to leave and then even boxing him in against the door, physically stopping him from leaving." - He tripped. Which you also acknowledged. I would not say it was force but an extension of his desperation to get Irie to understand what he was trying to convey. Irie just tried to leave after saying his peace. I don't need a textbook form of what force of coercion is (not trying to be rude ;D). Also, Irie did not seem phased that he was pinned to the door even knowing it was an accident. Blushing and trembling, the true face of a person who is being forced into something he does not want to do haha ;D Furthermore, right after the agreement of the deal Irie in his own thought bubble says "could i be expecting something from this" The lack of question mark at the end of the sentence leads me to believe that he is indeed hoping he will gain something out of the deal - am i making sense or are we once more at opposite ends? (Lord, give me strength this is long.) (Really loved your example btw, made me giggle but if I was in that situation which is supposed to be professional, I would sue for harassment. However, the scene between our two characters is not professional and hence calls for different measures).

"You're bringing up Irie saying he's been trying to make megane fall in love with him in ch 5 and trying to use that as evidence that Irie is gaining out of the arrangement and in extension not being forced, but you're forgetting that the deal was made in ch 3." - Irrelevant of when the deal was made, as I do not have a specific time frame between chapters, I believe that the motives behind the deal and agreement of the deal plays the biggest role in the story. Irie loves megane, yes? They both formed a deal. This deal was to date for a month (saying this for my own head) Where does it state that Irie will also try his best to get Megane to fall in love with him upon agreement of the deal? If Irie was being forced despite KNOWING the potential outcomes, wouldn't you think he would be a little less gung-ho about the deal because he knows it may end badly? I used chapter 5 as reference as once again I do not know the time frame between that scene and the day of the deal. It is very unlikely that his frame of mind changed that quickly from being reluctant to date to all of a sudden being in 'try-hard' mode. Hence my reasoning that although for a short while, Irie is also benefitting as he has received the opportunity to demonstrate the type of relationship he wishes to have with Megane. Not that he will ultimately get what he wants. Earlier you also stated that "Does Irie like megane? Yes, he says so himself. In this sense Irie gains a possible boyfriend out of the encounter" - It is not ideal, but Megane is not the only one who is benefiting from this deal. At the end of it, it is quite obvious that they may end up together as that's the cliche of Yaoi manga. if it does not happen then I will happily revoke this whole statement as it proves that Irie has not ultimately gained what he desires - Megane.

Finally, (Geez i could have written a whole essay at this point) " If you ask someone out and they say yes, you now have consent automatically to make sexual advances on them." No, No, No. Just because we agreed to date, does this automatically give you the right to mount me without my permission? I would understand if there was a mood going on which pretty much negates verbal consent as it is a mood killer, but there was no mood. With the kiss as a failure and the mood you were speaking about earlier not being present, how is this consent for sex? I can forgive and understand no consent for a kiss, but not sex. Furthermore, despite Irie saying that he loves how honest Megane is in terms of his outlook on kissing Irie, he says it is "pissing him off" at that moment in time. This does not mean he should demonstrate his desires through non consensual sex ... I'm not excusing that fact he stopped either ... If Megane was looking at him I have the feeling that Irie would have gone through with it. Depending on the outlook, isn't that rape? (not something I want to get into) People can rape their partners, it is common in abusive households. I don't think just because they are dating this automatically means consent for sex. Kissing, maybe...

I don't think I can whack out another of these Σ( ￣□￣||) ... You're reasoning is concrete but I just can't help but feeling that there is something more. Oh and in no way am I any longer implying that Irie is the bad guy ... It is just that a lot of people have expressed how they dislike Megane and I could not understand why when compared to Irie. Call me stubborn, eh? Haha ... They have both made bad decisions to certain degrees but they are very much interesting! It is not a story I would consider dropping just because I am unable to comprehend the motives of the characters ... That's the fun in reading Yaoi manga, future chapters may change my outlook.

Forgive typo's (￣∇￣") this made my head hurt.

Thank you for responding again. I can't tell if you meant that you're done with the conversation when you said "i don't think i could whack out another of these" or not so i'll just post another response in the same fashion.

In regards to my statement of "Irie had basically been dating megane beforehand" you said "This i have to disagree with. What is this 'basically dating' you speak of? Isn't this just Irie interpreting the relationship/situation as he likes?" and "You also state that Irie tried to 'progress their relationship', which relationship? From friends to lovers?"---I'll respond to the quotes in order: 1st quote- The way you put that makes it sound like he is refusing to face reality, but from what i understood it seemed to me that this was the logical conclusion Irie came up with because he didn't know if megane was even straight before the hotel scene (ch 4, pg 4), so up until the hotel scene what he took as their situation was that he met a cute guy he really liked and became friends with that made numerous "sexual advances" (the accidents) on him which made him come to the conclusion that megane likes him too. 2nd quote- When i said "progress their relationship", it was actually me quoting Irie, not me making a statement. When he gets asked by megane's dad(?) to accompany megane on his birthday, he says "isn't this a chance to progress our relationship" (ch 1, pg 11), which i was using as evidence that because of all of megane's accidental advances, Irie thinks they might like each other. I think Irie said "are you trying to make fun of gay people!" because he didn't believe megane when he said something as outlandish as "i've had bad luck since childhood that puts me in sexual positions exclusively with males".

In regards to my statement of: "Coercion by definition...stopping him from leaving" you responded saying "He tripped. Which you also acknowledged. I would not say it was force, but an extension of his desperation to get Irie to understand what he was trying to convey." and "Also, Irie did not seem phased being pinned to the door knowing it was an accident".---Quote 1- I did acknowledge he tripped as i wouldn't just leave out a piece of the story. I wouldn't say that this fact matters though because, while he DID trip, he DIDN'T remove his hands until AFTER Irie had agreed to the deal. He wanted to make Irie listen to him. Quote 2- Please don't take this the wrong way, but I don't understand how this matters. If i get robbed and am okay with what was stolen did i not get robbed? Just because he reacted to being pinned down by a guy he likes doesn't mean he wasn't pinned down. : D What matters is that Irie decided to say no and megane pinned him against the door to try and get him to say yes, the pinning in and of itself WOULD'VE been fine since it was an accident, but WASN'T fine since he chose to keep his arms up. I'm glad the example made you giggle by the way, its too bad that you felt like the situations weren't the same (professional vs personal). I thought it was a very good good comparison in that you are kind of required to act a certain way while dating. More refined or professional? And the shopkeep is required to act a certain way as well. It is also usually required of the employee to pitch merchandise. Meh.

In regards to my statement of "You're bringing up Irie saying...the deal was made in ch 3" you responded saying "Irrelevant (meanie : ‘ ( No, not really : D) of when the deal was made as i do not have a specific time frame in between chapters.", "Irie loves megane, yes? They both form a deal. They will date for a month. Where does it say Irie will try his best to make megane fall in love with him too?" and "If Irie was being forced despite KNOWING the potential outcomes, wouldn't you think he'd be a little bit less gung-ho about the deal because he knows it may end badly? I used chapter 5 as a reference because i don't have a specific time that has passed between that scene and the deal. It is very unlikely that his frame of mind changed that quickly from being reluctant to date to be in 'try hard mode'."--- Quote 1- So, what i was trying to say is that if they made an agreement to date in ch 3, how does Irie actively taking part in the dating process in ch 5 mean anything other than that he is upholding his end of the deal from ch 3? You were saying that for some reason this indicates that Irie has wanted their agreement from the beginning, putting aside the obvious flaw here, that being that Irie refused and wasn't participating at first, let me give an example of why this makes no sense. If you're a dog person , you hate cats, but you end up taking care of a sick kitten and keep it because you can't find an owner, does that mean you liked the kitten on sight? Quote 2- It says it in common sense, not trying to be mean, the deal was for them to date and see if megane will fall in love so of course Irie is going to participate. Two people are in a couple. Quote 3- That question is kind of hard to answer as it is a case by case scenario, you're asking me the probability of a human acting a certain way under certain conditions. In Irie's case he seems to be the type to immediately go on the offensive as shown in the mounting scene. You say you don't have a specific amount of time that has passed since the deal up to the scene in ch 5 and then say it's unlikely his frame of mind would change "so quickly", this makes no sense. You're saying you don't know how much time has passed, but then saying not much time has passed, or at least not enough for Irie to be going full throttle. Also, he WAS less gung-ho at first, when he said he didn't want to date him because if megane decides "after thinking about it, i can't like men after all." (ch 3, pg 11), Irie wouldn't want to have wasted his time. Also, also, (not a typo) you said that if Irie doesn't end up with megane then you will take back everything you said about Irie also gaining from the situation rather than just megane. This is flawed logic, just because you want something in the end doesn't mean you wanted it in the beginning. (see kitten example) Even if Irie DOES get megane in the end, which he will, it doesn't mean he wanted to try dating megane AT THE TIME OF THE DEAL. As a matter of fact, he rejects him because he doesn't want to date him.

TOUCHY SUBJECT INCOMMING!!: In regards to my statement of "if you ask someone out and they say yes, you now have consent automatically to make sexual advances on them" you said "No, no, no...Kissing, maybe"---Okay, i'm assuming we're both adults here, i think you knew what i meant when i said "sexual advances". Rape is a whole other thing entirely. You basically took what i said, that being "sexual advances" and took it to the highest radical degree where it'd be considered rape. You came over to my house, asked if you could have something to eat, i said help yourself and you cleared my damn fridge. You're talking about how "there wasn't a mood" and you even said "does me agreeing to date you mean i give you permission to mount me"? The first thing that needs established is that there WAS an attempt at making a mood, Irie didn't immediately hop on his dick. They watched a movie together, Irie tried to initiate a mood by holding megane's hand, megane failed to understand, Irie got mad, megane went after Irie and tripped resulting in him landing on top of Irie and despite the situation he didn't kiss Irie. Things happened that made Irie's intentions clear, that being that he wants sex, he even says it to megane. So it's not like he just sprung it on megane, megane just wasn't making any moves and Irie took the lead. They agreed to date, went on a movie date, attempted to have sex and stopped when Irie realized megane wasn't ready. Megane didn't fight him off, but didn't participate either because he doesn't know what to do. I never said it gives consent for sex, i said "sexual advances" for a reason.

Christ, i should publish this one. Wait, are you actually reading this sentence right now? Oh, god! Go rest your eyes, i'll go put my hands in ice water to stave off my growing arthritis.

This one is not designed to influence any response from your side but to clear up a few things with my OWN response as it has garnered a few misinterpretations on your part as to what I was actually trying to get across. (MY FAULT ENTIRELY, MY WRITING SUCKS ASS)

But first, please understand that my responses are not designed in anyway to influence the way in which you have understood what is happening within the manga. It is merely me, myself and I looking at the story from a different focal point (which I am guessing you already know ;D)

Okay. HERE WE GO. *cracks fingers* prepare for a lot of repeated words. (You can spot my favourites if you look closely).

"The way you put that makes it sound like he is refusing to face reality, but from what i understood it seemed to me that this was the logical conclusion Irie came up with because he didn't know if megane was even straight before the hotel scene" - This is not what i was trying to convey with my writing. My response was in response to you saying that "Irie had basically been dating megane beforehand" - I am not saying that Irie is necessarily refusing to face reality. Yes, I agree that he is following his most logical line of thought, but this 'logical conclusion' is wrong. Why is it wrong? Because he is just interpreting it in a way that he seems fit. You have suggested that the accidents (stupid Megane) "made him come to the conclusion that megane likes him too." This is what misinterpretation is!

Irie thought "Oh this guy must like me because of all of the signals" Any person would think this. The point I should convey is that if Irie was NOT gay and still experienced the same incidents with Megane, the last thought he would probably be thinking is "This person MUST like me" - It is all about perspective and interpretation of the situation. Because Irie IS gay, it is human nature to respond to the signals he is receiving from Megane. But this is where I am saying that in that scene, Irie thinking Megane likes him was his own bad interpretation of the scene. He misinterpreted that Megane liked him due to the accidental happenings. Ever fell in love with someone and their kindness led you to believe that they liked you too, but it turns out they were just being friendly? That was a misinterpretation on your part. You interpreted this kindness as a response to your own feelings. This is not me bashing on Irie. This is me saying that sometimes human flaws get in the way and lead to misunderstandings. Hence why I would not blame Megane for his actions as his INTENTIONS were not to make Irie think he also likes him. Despite how sexual his actions were, if his intentions were not what Irie is making them out to be, is this truly Megane's fault? Neither are at fault, it was a simple (no so simple) misunderstanding on Irie's part.

"When i said "progress their relationship", it was actually me quoting Irie, not me making a statement." - I knew this (⌒▽⌒) As I cannot question Irie, I questioned you as to which relationship you thought he was trying to progress.

"I think Irie said "are you trying to make fun of gay people!" because he didn't believe megane when he said something as outlandish as "i've had bad luck since childhood that puts me in sexual positions exclusively with males". - Yes I agree. But once again, excusing the cliche ploy used by the Mangaka, Megane's intentions were not to insult gay people like Irie was thinking. At the time of my first post it seemed that Irie was butthurt and embarrassed that he misinterpreted (is this my favourite word?!) the situation. However, looking at it from a different perspective (fave word no.2) it was in the heat of the moment that Irie said that. Therefore, it is not something I should blame Irie for any longer.

(Hopefully by now you can see that I am looking at this from my side as well as trying to see if from yours, and that it will help you to understand where my original post was coming from)

"I did acknowledge he tripped as i wouldn't just leave out a piece of the story. I wouldn't say that this fact matters though because, while he DID trip, he DIDN'T remove his hands until AFTER Irie had agreed to the deal. He wanted to make Irie listen to him." I am guessing that you saw this as Megane refusing (for lack of better word) to remove his hands in his hopes that he could coerce (whether intentional or unintentional) Irie into listening to him. I saw this scene as Megane not removing his hands due to him tripping and that it was a delayed reaction to getting up (I can't give a reason as to why i perceived it in such a way, maybe it is my naivety). Afterall, he did apologise at the end of the chapter and implied that it was not intentional (Is this fave word no.3?!).

I can see where you were coming from now though. Maybe you can see my perspective? it may be a little difficult as I'm not even sure myself why I saw this scene in the way I did. However, I can say that my initial reaction to it not being coercion or force still stands strong as Irie's reactions in that scene just did not seem honest to me (I can't really defend myself with this point because it's just how it seems to me). Hence why my standing on this part of the story has still not changed. I DO see where you are coming from and if I chose to read the story again from your perspective I would most certainly agree. Unfortunately, my perspective makes more sense for my understanding of the story.

"If i get robbed and am okay with what was stolen did i not get robbed? Just because he reacted to being pinned down by a guy he likes doesn't mean he wasn't pinned down." Slightly out of context. You would react differently to different situations. The fundamentals are the same but how you would react to the situation is ultimately different and depend on numerous factors. It's not something I would get into as everyone is different.

"megane pinned him against the door to try and get him to say yes" Where was is stated that this was to get him to yes? It is up the the reader to decide this so it feels like my perspective on this scene is harder to understand than initially thought. You believe it was coercion by extension of force. I see it as a delayed reaction to falling. I can see where you are coming from. It's just a little harder to explain where I am coming from.

"its too bad that you felt like the situations weren't the same (professional vs personal). I thought it was a very good good comparison in that you are kind of required to act a certain way while dating." I disagree. Couple dynamics are different for each relationship.

"And the shopkeep is required to act a certain way as well. It is also usually required of the employee to pitch merchandise." Shopkeepers are the face of the store and are required to interact with customers at a professional level. Even when pitching merchandise. They are not allowed to sway a customers decisions, they have a code of conduct to which they MUST abide by unless they want to be sacked/fined/persecuted. Now when it comes to personal relationships such as Megane and Irie's, there are no rules or regulations that govern how these two people MUST act in the relationship. However, I would say that relationship ethics CAN govern how people in a relationship may act :)

"So, what i was trying to say is that if they made an agreement to date in ch 3, how does Irie actively taking part in the dating process in ch 5 mean anything other than that he is upholding his end of the deal from ch 3?" I'm sorry if what I said in my previous post came across as mean btw Σ(っ°Д °;)っ that is not what I had inteneded at all! *hugs*

Right, in your previous post, it did not seem like this is what you were trying to convey. My bad (⊙…⊙ ). What I meant by my response is that if he is SO reluctant about the deal and absolutely does not want it (which is what I had originally perceived from your post) why is he trying so hard to make Megane like him? To me it seemed like Irie is aware that the deal may possibly end up not working out which may leave him with a broken heart. Despite this, he is still trying his hardest to make the deal work out (this is how it seems to me) as he gets upset when his desires are not reciprocated i.e kissing and sex. Nowhere within the deal does it state that BOTH of them will have to try their hardest. The only thing i got from that scene is that Megane has one month to fall in love and that was the ultimatum. I used Ch 3&5 as evidence because I do not know how many days had passed since the bar scene and the failed sex scene or the bar scene. This is me saying that if, for example, only two days had passed, is this really enough time for Irie's attitude to have changed to his predicament? In addition, I am aware that before Irie had made the deal he had tried to leave because of his 'reluctance'. However, a page after he agreed to the deal, it was hinted that Irie is was likely expecting something from the deal. Which led me to think that he was not entirely against the deal somewhere in his heart.

"You were saying that for some reason this indicates that Irie has wanted their agreement from the beginning" No, I am not saying he definitely wanted the deal from the beginning, but that he was not entirely AGAINST it either. I believe that Megane's sincerity is what swayed his decision. Not by force or coercion but by genuinely attempting to show Irie how important he is to him and how far he is willing to go. This is what I received from this scene. It is fine if you don't share the same view. I just wanted to show what makes most sense to me from the situation. After all, that is what the comment section is for, right? ;D

In response to one of my comment, you said: "That question is kind of hard to answer as it is a case by case scenario, you're asking me the probability of a human acting a certain way under certain conditions." This is not what I had intended. I'm trying to say that most people (me included) have a natural aversion of going along with something that may end badly. This is why I could not understand why it seemed like Irie was trying his best. I may have overlapped myself with Irie. Something readers tend to do, they relate to the characters.

"You say you don't have a specific amount of time that has passed since the deal up to the scene in ch 5 and then say it's unlikely his frame of mind would change "so quickly", this makes no sense. You're saying you don't know how much time has passed, but then saying not much time has passed, or at least not enough for Irie to be going full throttle. I don't know the time frame which is why I GUESSED that not much time has passed. This is me saying that BECAUSE not much time has passed, it seemed unlikely that Irie's frame of mind could have changed (for me atleast). Hence my reasoning in earlier paragraphs that even before the deal was struck, he was not ENTIRELY against it.

"Also, also, (not a typo) you said that if Irie doesn't end up with megane then you will take back everything you said about Irie also gaining from the situation rather than just megane. This is flawed logic, just because you want something in the end doesn't mean you wanted it in the beginning. You have misconstrued what I was trying to say. If you remember in an earlier post, I said "Irie is also benefitting as he has received the opportunity to demonstrate the type of relationship he wishes to have with Megane" - If you refer back to the amove paragraph, I believe that Irie is not entirely against it. He definitely wanted Megane in the beginning. He did not want possible heart break. During the duration of the deal I am saying that Irie is gaining due to being giving the chance to make a possible relationship. He is gaining in the short-term month they are dating. When I said I would revoke the statement, I am referring to his long-term gains which is being in an authentic relationship with Megane. This is why I said he will not "ultimately get what he wants" - This is me referring to Irie. Earlier you also said "Megane got what he wanted, not Irie" - But Megane just wanted to be friends? So I fail to see how he 'ultimately' (emphasis needed) got what he wants either? Yes he wanted Irie to stay with him, so during the month deal he DOES get what he wants, but that is a SHORT-TERM gain. I was referring to long-term. They both gain short-term but only one of them will gain long-term. It is very likely that Irie will be the one gaining long-term as that is where my view on the cliche came from.

"Even if Irie DOES get megane in the end, which he will, it doesn't mean he wanted to try dating megane AT THE TIME OF THE DEAL. As a matter of fact, he rejects him because he doesn't want to date him." - As stated earlier, to me, Irie did not seem all that phased about the agreement of the deal which led me to believe he was not entirely against it.

Once more we have reached the end of a chapter ... Just kidding ;D

"Okay, i'm assuming we're both adults here, i think you knew what i meant when i said "sexual advances" - Yes, I understood what you meant but I was referring specifically to the sex scene. "The first thing that needs established is that there WAS an attempt at making a mood, Irie didn't immediately hop on his dick." Irie DID try to make a mood but FAILED. If holding hands failed and so did kissing, how was his next logical reaction "Maybe if I mount him he might get a clue" All i'm saying is that no consent was given for SEX. He acknowledged that his attempts had failed due to Megane being the way he is. Don't get me wrong, if we are dating and you invite me round for a movie, i'm obviously going to get the idea that kissing and other "sexual advances" are bound to follow. However, those who are unaccustomed to dating are not as quick to get these signals. We were all at this stage at some point in life, I knew I certainly was and my first boyfriend at the time ended up with a bruised nose and a bloody lip xD It just seemed like Irie was getting mad for Megane's lack of reaction and then decided sex was the best solution despite him failing to 'get the mood going ;D'

To make things clear once again, I am not in any way stating that what you are saying is wrong because it does not fall in line with my reasoning or how i choose to read the story. I think at most I AM able to see where you are coming from thanks to your time and patience with this discussion. This post was also not designed for a response as I mainly wanted to end the conversation by clearing up a few of the misunderstanding my previous post(s) had caused. HOWEVER, please, please, please do feel free to reply if you feel like anything else should be cleared up or corrected (although I may not reply, my plane to NY is in a few hours) I would like to ask you a question though, is the way I chose to read or interpret the story wrong?

Erodesu-x: Officially out ;D

I don't personally feel like your interpretation is wrong, it seems to me that you have valid reason to believe what you do. It would've been one thing if your perspective were so out there that there was no way it was right, but in this case it seems to be a case of us both having read the same thing and taken SLIGHT differences from it (the difference being that you feel as though Irie is gaining, and wanted [at least internally], a chance to get with megane while as i chose not to think past Irie refusing to go out with him and took it for face value as that he genuinely didn't feel that the chance was worth it due to the possibility of it ending bad and so he chose to say no. You feel as though megane won Irie's internalized feelings over so he said yes, while as i, once again, didn't look into the scene [the pinning to the door scene] and just took it as force). If i came across negative in any fashion that made you think that i was criticising your interpretation , i apologize as that wasn't my intention. At no point in this discussion have i been upset, that "meanie" joke was just that, a joke. : ) After talking with you i think i have a better understanding of what you were thinking. I see now that you're saying Irie gains from the month by having a chance to get a boyfriend, where i stand on this differs from where you do for no other reason than the slight difference in perspective mentioned above. I also understand your thoughts on the sex scene, personally i don't 100%(?) agree that the mounting was uncalled for since i'm under the impression that megane is strong (i believe it says it somewhere in there, possibly during the pinning scene.) and would have resisted if he wanted to, he even just said he was "shocked", but that is just my opinion. I'm not saying mounting people is okay, i'm saying that, to megane, Irie mounting megane was okay. As far as things i feel might need to be cleared up, i can only think of one: from what you wrote it seemed that you feel as though on megane's end the deal was made so he could stay friends with Irie. Maybe this could be the case, but it seemed to me that Irie had already made it clear they couldn't be friends and that they were both under the understanding that they'd be moving forward as a couple. That is just what i thought though.

It comes down to a very simple thing.

Megane wants to remain close because he has no friends. He likes Irie as a friend and he is willing to do whatever it takes to keep Irie by his side.

Irie wants someone to love him, romantically, and kiss and have sex with him. He wants a lover.

Irie has tried repeatedly to get rid of megane-san because he can feel himself falling in love with him and unrequited love is a fucking bitch to deal with. Even more so if that unrequited love is with a friend.

Megane-san is demanding that Irie remain a close friend even though he knows Irie is in love with him. He refuses to let Irie go. Pretty damn selfish, wouldn't you say?

What happens if Irie said okay? That they just remain friends? What if megane-san starts to date someone else?

Why the hell should Irie sacrifice his happiness and potential for love for someone who will never love him the way he wants and needs to be loved?

Since megane-san refuses to leave Irie alone he proposed the ultimatum. It's really a gamble on his part. Either he wins and megane-san falls in love with him and he gets a lover. Or he loses and he falls deeper in love but megane-san can't feel the same...however he wins by being able to cut him out of his life so he can heal his broken heart and move on to someone who can love him.

It's not fair. But all's fair in love and war and Irie deserves happiness too even though megane-san only wants a friend. Unfortunately, Irie fell in love with megane-san otherwise...maybe they could have just remained friends.

Life sucks sometimes. Sometimes we have to cut people out of our lives in order to heal broken hearts or emotional damage. Some people are just toxic for each other and with megane-san it will be a toxic relationship for Irie if they remain friends because Irie will never get over his broken heart while being reminded of it every day.

Some people are able to get over a unrequited love for a friend...but that takes time and sometimes space apart and they decide it's worth that effort. Why should Irie devote that much time to recover from a toxic relationship (friendship) for a complete stranger he only met a few months back?

Oh, hi akuma :3

Hi! Sorry for the late reply, had matters to deal with overseas hence not being able to spend a lot of time considering a well thought out (sarcasm not intended) reply.

I agree with what you are saying but as discussed with @youraedthiswrogn I have chosen to read this story with what makes most sense to me. If you read through our old posts I am sure you will find answers to some of the questions you may have directed towards me (⌒▽⌒)

I'd love to go a verbal round on this but @youraedthiswrogn has completely took it out of me (Haha). We both took into consideration that we perceive the story differently. We acknowledged and put aside our differences (or at least I think we did, haha).

Hopefully, my initial post won't come back to bite me in the ass as I had written it without considering why I had perceived what was happening in the story. Further discussions with other people has helped me to see if from different view points, but mine just makes more sense to me ╮(￣▽￣)╭

Sorry for the lacklustre reply ╥﹏╥

Thanks for your input though! (●'◡'●)ﾉ

Im glad someone stated this because I exactly think of this too the entire time.. Especially on the mounting part (ｰ"ｰ;)

Thanks a lot!!!,

Well, this comet is 50% disappointing and 50% reassuring, because how are they gonna have sex like that? ┑(￣Д ￣)┍

Fingers...and...stuff I was thinking at first...but knowing they don't do stuff kind of reassured me

Just a suggestion. Q-tip.

Not bad, but what about tongue? Massive licks...

It'll break Σ(っ°Д °;)っ

Well, you don't HAVE to stick it in the ass, but you could also do something like this....
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/free_dj_can_haruka_have_sex_with_rin_after_suddenly_turning_into_an_odd_little_lifeform/

O_O... i've seen everything now thanks to you.

I'm glad I enlightened you, but do you think this can POSSIBLY go down? ┑(￣Д ￣)┍

Wouldn't massive tongue licks leave you covered in saliva? That's pretty gross tbh.

Depends on the uke though! Once BL takes over, there's no telling how you feel about disgusting stuff..... And what about sex toys? Vibrations man...