Black Orihime's Topics (218)

we need some guy to knock some sense into him. im so tired of him and 2021 just started ugh

The men are having dreams/ hallucinations of their sexual fantasies lmao. Where the hell is the rape part of this

Regardless, it’s not romanizing it??? Especially if there is a warning stating that it’s non con

1 and 2) u right, I skipped around chapters and didn’t get the context. I checked back and the warning is quite obvious on chapter 1 tho.

3 and 4) ....Pretty sure that most people who read non con, know that it’s bad irl and wouldn’t inflict it on others. Ur acting like manwha and webtoon should set examples for people when They are just here to entertain

Outside of this manwha /webtoon, how is non con play between two consenting adults harmful?

Like deadass, keeping ur mental and physical health in check when getting into certain plays/kinks (for instance: BSDM, choking, ddlg, etc.) is key. Liking a certain play doesn’t mean u disregard the bad experiences someone else may have had of someone forcing their will on them.

Practicing such things in a safe environment doesn’t hurt anyone outside of the people participating

I’m honestly curious about what made u pick this manwha, and continues to read. Bc I could already tell it was gonna have some spicy things in it before starting.

the title is Called Screen Grab w/ a guy seemingly trapped in a close space...how does this NOT imply they guy is gonna be objectified lmao.

I’m talking about outside this webtoon/manwha.... you said “non consensual play is harmful and disgusting”, whichimplies that u r talking about beyond this manhwa. That’s why I said, why would such plays be wrong between 2 consenting adults

The correct term is BL. And u might wanna check the year the BL u read Bc more recent ones have gotten a lot better at avoid such plots and etc.

Yeah sure, if BL and porn is ur only source of sexual education that’s gonna give u a warped view but for most people it’s not lol. People can created fucked up stories (ex: Killing Stalking) and still understand what consent is. A fictional work isn’t representative of someone’s ideals

....that’s the charm of the manwha. The MC dominates men into submission. U could literally think of it as a sexual fantasy in someone’s head. Idk about u but most people don’t imaging themselves and their fantasy partner verbally consenting at the start of their imagination.

Yes, so if it’s not ur cup of tea, u didn’t have to comment all of this in the first places...nor didn’t u have to call people who do like non con plays “harmful and disgusting”.

Bc this manwha is literally just a visual non con fantasy, nothing more.

I mean what does “screen grab” Imply to u...like it’s sounds like u owning something on ur phone/device right? So it u see a half dressed guy /trapped/ and the verb “grab” it should imply some nsfw possessive shit is going on.

Like context/inferences can be made. No one would click this with a kid watching their phone, that’s for sure

U never explained...why it’s harmful and disgusting. I explained why it isn’t, so it’s fair u do the same w/o bias

Like I said before, webtoons aren’t there to teach... they are there to entertain.

And yeah people are saying out of pocket stuff Bc none of this is real lmao. This whole website is full of horny people, u gonna see the worse of it on here.

I’m sorry u had to read things with no content warnings and it disgusted u. However, that has nothing to do with other readers on this site along with the translators who chose to translate problematic works (and put warnings like this one).

-at the end of the day. U commenting + and us arguing on an illegal website isn’t gonna do shit to fix what you’re complaining about ._..

There’s a lot to unpack lmao but let’s start with the “Written by women for women” bullshit u just pulled....

This statement implies multiple things:

>Do u want the author to out themself for u to feel comfortable?

Many BL content creators are queer, and as we know, most countries do not like nor care about LGBT rights. Though the “99% of BL is written by weird straight women” rhetoric is a widespread lie, it does protect those queer people who want (and half the time have) to hide their identities while creating BL

> Gay men can’t enjoy BL made by women
Gatekeeping doesn’t help anyone, If u want a genre to get more attention u gotta Yome it up to a wider audience. Like should BL only be limited to Gay men; GL to gay women; and Hetero romance to heterosexuals? Of course not. Being about to relate to another person may help u realize things about urself (ex: a girl realizing she’s Bi after reading BL Bc the possibility of same sex relationships was opened in her mind; the same can and does happen with bi/gay men with GL)
> Gay men can’t write problematic BL

For my last point, I implore u to look at
Gengoroh Tagame‘s works. He is a famous BL mangaka known for his sadomasochism works (not much consent in that lmao)

Idk if u witnessed the whole Killing Stalking trend, but a lot of people who didn’t like KS accused fans of “romanizing abuse” or “fetishizing gay men”....pretty much happens with any gay media that tried to take a darker turn. It’s counterproductive to limit queer content to nice/softs fluffy things when reality isn’t like that.


Also: the author isn’t responsible for the reader’s lack of sexual education... the 18+ warning on porn and other nsfw media is there to indicate that ADULTS who know right from wrong, are the audience for this work. Not some random ass kid.

Like if a kid plays a 17+ horror game and gets nightmares, u aren’t gonna blame the game r u?

Did u read my last point... did u search up the artist

Like if u want me to link u a interview of Japanese LGBT group leaders and their thoughts on BL manga, I can try to find it lol.

The conclusion @ the end of the article was that: they are happy that BL has gotten a lot better than it was back when it first started, characters seem to break away from the “ forbidden fruit” and rape tropes of the past and actually have the character accepting their sexuality.

There’s bigger issues to face in the real world than two fictional guys going atbit

Saying “I can tell it’s written by women” implies u know the author’s identity...that’s why I said should authors out themselves for their works to be acceptable for u? Theoretically, if the author of this work was a guy then what now. What would u say then.

> whether they are queer is not the issue. Many yaoi mangaka are are actual bisexual females or lesbian with some being straight and/or queer women working under a male pen-name.

I do not care whether they are queer or not, the point is that yaoi is written by *primarily* females and it’s either fetishizing gay men/sex are misrepresenting gay men which causes the fujo’s who consume the content to exhibit fetishizing behaviors which, as you could guess, does not benefit gay men at all. Now, I’m not speaking for all homosexual men here, but there is no doubt that the yaoi written primarily by women are the main cause for why fujo are known for acting the way they do and why Fujo’s have gotten so comfortable fetishizing gay men in the first place.

> Gay men can absolutely enjoy BL written by women, I have a whole list of BL written by women that I enjoy albeit, it’s very short. And I’m all for these thing helping people explore their sexuality. But none of that excuses the blatant fetishization of gay men and romanticization of societal taboos that could potentially negatively effect gay men by reinforcing stigma surrounding homosexuality.

> Yes, gay men can write problematic BL. Although, personally, my problem has less to do with the overall depictions of said things that might be considered “problematic” (unless it’s something like this manhwa, an app that basically allows you to sexually assault men doesn’t sit right with me) and more with the romanization of it. It’s possible to read about depictions of rape, abuse, assault, etc in manga/hwa without romanticizing, or even openly talking about how hot you think it is.

Cause then you have exchanges with homophobes that go like this:

A: “All gay men do is assault straight men and prey on children!”

B: “That ins’t true, if a gay man assault someone, it’s because he’s a criminal, not because he’s gay. Gay people are just as normal as any other person”

A: “If that’s so true then what is this manga I found that shows a gay man assaulting a straight man and this other one with a child?! And why’re people talking about how hot it is?!”

See how that works? Stop like unconsensual sex takes place in her manga as well, but the effects of romanticizing it in BL are different due to existing stigmas. I’m not gonna flat out say “all depictions of rape that are unrealistic should be banned!” That’s just an impossible ideal, but the least I ask is that people don’t romanticize it, or at least don’t do it publically.

So then 3 BLs , 1 a manwha and two manga, compares to the many 1 Volume or one shot BL Manga releases and translated the past few years that have two men falling in love with each other while acknowledging their sexuality (w/ consent, just how U like it).


Like it’s bold to assume that the works that get translated are a good representation of the Bl scene now. (I said before, your original comment is useless Bc we’re both reading on an illegal sitw that doesn’t support the author whatsoever)

Correcting typos:

Last paragraph “stuff* like unconsensual sex takes place in het* manga as well”**

For the last point, check out the gay mangaka I mentioned. He doesn’t condemn rape and etc in his work directly, it just exists as dark works. He depicts his sadomaso works as sexy and his readers enjoy it so what now ?

For point #1: ._. Lesbians and relate to gay people lol. I’m pretty such anyone queer can relate to a queer story or experience to some degree.

Fujoshi (fem)/ fudanshi (masc)/fujin (gender neutral) are all terms used to describe people who read BL. That’s it.

Fujin talking about how sexy some anime guy is or what they would want (or want some else) to do to the character in question isn’t fetishization.

It does cross to fetishizing when it comes to irl people. And once again, that stereotype of Fujoshi was pushed by misogynistic people who hated BL + the loud minority. That’s out of the hands of authors Bc they make it clear their works are fictional.

BL doesn’t have the wide spread impact u think it does, it’s not that well known in Japan nor could u walk up to someone in another country and expect them to know what BL is, or understand the concept. “What about this manga I found” whew that made me laugh ngl.

Damn, sounds like u should avoid it instead of arguing with people

Lmaooo so fudanshi, a guy who enjoys BL should be just as harmful correct?

Yeah people don’t like talking about how they like BL Bc of people like u who assume everything bad about them lol. That’s literally why I wasn’t open about it till this year?

> I already know about Tagame, and I stated that my problem has less to do with the overall depictions of rape and more to do with the people who openly romanticize it.

> yes, gay men and lesbian women *can* relate in many way but I still fail to see your point because there’ differences in the stigma surrounding both sexualities, whether lesbian and bisexual women are able to relate to gay and bisexual men on any level is irrelevant to the fact that the manga written primarily by women *are* the main reason Fujo’s have been exhibiting such toxi/feitishizinf behaviors

> I never said that Isnt what it meant?

> I never said that either?

> mangaka are still apart of the problem. Many yaoi perpetuate MLM stereotypes that most of us want to break free from. They don’t positively effect gay men at all. I’ve personally experienced this. The Seme/uke dynamic stereotype is a very good example. Yes, what the readers do with the mangakas work is out of the mangakas control but they’re still at fault for the perpetuation fo negative MLM stereotypes.

> I think you fail to see my point. Whether it’s actually “as wide spread” as you think I’m making it out to be doesn't change that fact that there *are* people who use yaoi as validation for their homophobia and Fujo’s who exhibit toxic/fetishizing behaviors are all over the place. I’ve literally experienced it first hand. You don’t have to search far and wide for Fujo accounts on Twitter, Instagram tiktok, even that’re constantly perpetuating negative stereotypes about gay men while they’re discussing BL albeit, I think most of it is subconsciously. I’ve even had an ex- friend who was really into yaoi and would constantly assigne uke/seme labels to irl men, call bisexual men gay, and constantly infantilize gay men. That behavior only really started [around me] after she became open about her interest in BL with me.

U keep saying harmful this harmful that but u really don’t elaborate much. Please search up the history of the word fujoshi. It’s a reclaimed word Bc homophobic, misogynistic incels said women who read works about gay mean aren’t “marriageable women”...as if that should be a woman’s sole goal in life. It was reclaimed as a statement to say “who cares” and to not view queer works as nasty/detestable

Contrary to popular belief, “fujoshi” doesn’t *actually* means “someone who fetishized gay men,” that’s just what it’s come to be associated with.
The label itself is not harmful, rather the actions a lot of the people who take up the title are what’s harmful.

I suppose the stigma surrounding the word has change but the overal definition is just someone who actively reads BL. I have nothing against the label. I’m just not a fan of a lot of the people who use it.

There are positive effects to BL, like the fact it opens up people to the possible of two men being in a relationship.

BL isn’t perfect, it never will be just like any other romance genre. But to disregard it’s positive effects and it’s evolution towards POSITIVE portrayal, isn’t helpful. I’ve been into BL for a long ass time, I’ve seen it change and it’s a lot better from let’s say, 5 yrs ago.

Seme/uke terminology is dying out. Yaoi is an outdated and incorrect term, please use BL.
And people on tiktok aren’t representative of the majority of people who like BL, as mentioned before, they are a loud minority that just got into the genre.

I’m sorry u experienced that with ur ex-friend, but not everyone is like that? People on this site are wild asf but most don’t even do that to irl people. And if some people do to it to irl, I promise there’s always a fujin that finds it weird asf.

Anyways I’m going to sleep so to conclude:

1) this BL doesn’t “romantize” nor “normalize” non con. There’s a warning at the start of the manwha AND it’s a 18+ work (marked on legal site) which implies it will have mature themes that are condemned in real life

2) BL has its faults like any other genre but it has positive effects (ex: simply making people aware of same sex relationships)

3) To degrage people over fictional works w/ gay men that cover dark themes is not the move. If they distinguish between fiction and reality, it’s all good.

4) I can’t believe we really argued over this fictional ass character on this illegal ass site filled with for at least an hour

5) ur original comment was dumb asf, the author ain’t gonna see this, if they did they would try to take down the chapters lmao

I’m not trying to discard its positive effects. What you’re doing here is a logical fallacy called “whataboutism”

I’m not trying to downplay the positive effects but I am specifically discussing it’s negative effects, which outweigh the positives. I’m very grateful that BL and yaoi introduces people to homosexuality and opens their minds about it... I just wish it didn’t create the modern Fujoshi and could go about it without introducing people to stereotypes about gay men that a lot of us wanna get rid of.

Seme/uke may not be *as* used anymore, but the stereotypes surrounding the terms have carried over to ‘top/bottom’ which were terms originally created by the gay/lesbian communities. The seme/uke dynamic stereotype says that aggressive dominance and hyper masculinity are attributes of a top and femininity and submissive are attributes of a bottom. This has crossed over on to the words top/bottom.

BL still refers to [primarily] doujinshi in japan? BL is a subgenre yaoi and consists primarily of SFW romance.

They’re hardly a minority. Look, there’s a lot of behaviors I would consider ( http://www.mangago.zone/thing/about/238579/) fetishizing and your average fujo probably exhibits those behaviors, the more out-there Fujo’s are just the ones with the loudest voice, unfortunately. I’m very aware that not *all* fujoshi are like that. I’ve had some very productive conversations with Fujoshi before who were nothing short of respectful and cool people. But, unfortunately, the majority of Fujoshi are not like that. I’ve been active in the community for years, probably since around 2014 or so and the majority of Fujoshi have talked to have gotten fairly comfortable with exhibiting toxic and fetishizing behaviors as a result of the yaoi they consume. I’ll give them the benefit of the doubt, I don’t think they do it on purpose and some of them are willing to check themselves when called out, but then you have entire communities with thousands of members practically defending their right to fetishize MLM despite how much myself and other MLM people have expressed how it effects us negatively.

Look, I get your argument, but it doesn’t take away from mine. I can acknowledge the positives of yaoi but the negatives are just very bad and I’ve had a lot of negative experiences with people as a result of yaoi and the kinds of things it’s perpetuates and introduces people to. I understand that it’s written by queer women most of the time and it isn’t their intention to perpetuate the things they do, and I get that not all Fujo’s act like how I’ve said they do. But none of this takes away from the fact that the negatives of yaoi impact gay men and the authors are still at fault. Let’s just agree to disagree.

Stfu and start reading more hentai, pleb. I'm so done with these "buT it's RaPe" people showing up in femdom mangas. Go waste your energy on BL - I don't see NEARLY as much people complaining about rape there.

Just because it includes rape doesn't mean it thinks it's ok. By your logic we should ban all media centered around murderers. Also, why don't you just waste your energy on commenting on BL. I don't see you saying "hi author can we please not glamorise rape" in stuff like Painter of the Night.

Don't call other people "kids" when your grammar insinuates the notion that you still haven't completed 4th grade.

It's "Kid, go to bed and argue with your mama, weirdo," not the illegible bs that your single braincell came up with.

You're the one using ad hominem to evade my argument. No one's saying rape isn't bad. Reread my comment.

Oh wait, that was insensitive, especially when considering that you're illiterate. :)

I have to admit I was surprised to hear that some BL authors were queer because I was always under the impression it was written by straight women. I am wondering if Walk on Water author is one of those, since it is so queer. Do you know?

Like its a succubus in what story, book, fairy tale, movie, cartoon anything did demons ever ask for consent to do whatever? It's a succubus should she go "Hi im a demon type succubus here to suck your soul out, can i PLEASE?"

I agree with you on another level, this was truly disgusting, this is beyond rape and humiliating. People who find this okay is NOT okay

So you wrote a whole dissertation on another webtoon’s comment section saying that rape and non-con stuff was all bad regardless of excuse, meaning, or portrayal but then wrote that Seungho’s raping wasn’t “that bad” as though there are degrees of badness in rape?! You cannot say that all rape romanticization is bad and then say that someone’s raping was not “that bad” until recently. Either it’s 100% wrong (from the beginning and there is no “well, it wasn’t that bad then”) for you or there are “levels”. Do you pick and choose what to feel offended about?

Sangwoo did rape though

Just as you don’t know who I am, you don’t know the majority of authors who create BL/Yaoi as well as the people who consume that kind of content. Your words signaling women out were not only very demeaning to a whole sex/gender but they were very misinformed. Assuming that a significant portion of women who consume or create this kind of content are either fetishizers or rape sympathizers is not only derogatory but also misogynistic.

You did not explain my point nor apologized for your words regarding female authors and consumers. Women receive enough misogyny as it is. Female authors already receive hate and have their works deemed as either inherently inferior, more morally apprehensive, or as lesser than men’s. The same is true for female consumers. It seems that any and all media that is made by women for women receives even more hate than media created for men by men. The “I’m not gay” comment made by Sangwoo is not meant to serve as fetishizing fuel. The man was raped by his mother, he sees the women he sleeps with as nothing more than annoying prey that should be dealt with swiftly. He has no real feelings for the other MC.
The only attachment he has to him is the fact that MC reminds him of his mother. Sangwoo clearly does not understand human emotions or relations. He does not see sex as normal people would because of his trauma. The relationship is clearly NOT fetishized. If anything, I would argue that Sangwoo not being gay is far more progressive than you think. Not portraying a character that kills and rapes constantly and abuses physically and mentally of others as gay is clearly a good way of showing that gay people are not inherently murderers, rapists, or twisted. Sangwoo does not spare a thought towards other people regardless of their sexuality. He see people as victims or prey not as humans. He sees women as annoying (because of his mother) and he sees gay men as disgusting. There is no fetishization that the author intended. To say that would mean that the author wanted straight women to swoon for Sangwoo. However the author shows that this is not the case by having Sangwoo kill innocent women. The author does not want anybody to glamorize the story nor the contents.
Stop trying to assume what women feel, think, or transmit through their stories. If something is not to your liking you have every bit of a right to talk about it but please leave the generalization of women and women entirely out of their conversation. Rather than using an authors gender/sex to say that their content sucks in part because they are a woman and, therefore, will mean that they will fetishize gay men, instead judge their stories. You have no business bringing their sex/gender into the discussion of the quality of their works.

You being a woman doesn’t mean you cannot be a misogynist, first of all. Second of all, calling women out on their bullshit? Who do you think you are with that “holier than thou” bs philosophy? I agree with some of the points you made earlier but get this through your skull. Authors are not teachers nor parents. They are not required to satisfy your moral standards. They are not responsible for making you feel safe, ok, or right. Don’t like it, don’t read it. Simple. Third of all, since you said that you are a woman and that you are a lesbian, that means you are neither a guy nor gay. If gay men have a problem with this kind of content, I’m sure they have mouths to speak they don’t need a white savior complex person to come along and speak on their behalf to get people to listen. They are perfectly capable of saying something themselves. They don’t need someone is shining armor to come out of the blue and speak on their behalf. You don’t represent their community, so don’t lump all gay men as thinking the same as you think. Your patronizing attitude of telling people what is right or wrong based on fictional characters in a fictional story is ludicrous. This is not the old days when authors of stories where condemned for the nature of their works. Wilde’s fiasco with “The Picture of Dorian Gray” happened a long time ago and it proves that going after authors of fictional stories that may not adhere to your moral compass is not right. BL/Yaoi as we know it began in Japan and was intended for a Japanese audience. It plays on many of the tropes found in Japanese literature. The whole “rape trope” actually comes from older classics of Japanese literature that does not actually represent real rape. The rest of the countries like Korea that’s started to make similar content became heavily inspired by those same tropes that were used. Women making BL/Yaoi content only began a few decades ago. If you think that it is “disrespectful” and “fetishizing” the bulk of the work that is produced in that genre, then you should see the thousands of works throughout Japanese literature that were written by men for men. Stories featuring mlm relationships have a more than one thousand year old tradition it was dominated by men for men. The genre and its contents was not created in Japan and in other East Asian countries because a bunch of horny women decided “Hey let’s fetishize gay men!” Only somebody that has not done the appropriate research would think something like that. You did think that Sangwoo was being fetishized because you believed that the author had made a “I’m only gay for senpai” trope for him and I explained how that was not the case. I demonstrated that neither Sangwoo nor his relationship to MC is being fetishized.
If you want to read harmful stereotypes about gay men, and rape fetishization, then read more East Asian literature made by men for men. Women don’t deserve to be “called out” for something they did not come up with nor had any power over until recently. They have actually been working hard to reverse some of the more harmful stereotypes and tropes out there. It may not be coming as fast as you want but it is still coming. Reversing something that was a thing for thousands of years will take some time. I do agree with some of your points, especially the list of things you find frustrating. But that still gives you no right to single women out for it when there are bigger aggressors.
If you want to read a work made by a man that explores him coming to terms with his sexuality in the context of WWII in Japan, I would recommend “Confessions of A Mask” by Yukio Mishima.

lol I didn't even know he was black

If you think about it thought, the black one was the nicest one.

SMOOTH MOVE THO! SHE HAD KILL HIM WRITTEN ALL OVER HER EYES!!! :U

I miss this kind of deep emotionally heavy psychological stuff it’s the only thing thats got me on my tippy toes anymore we need more story!! and more impactful art! we’re in a rut where fantasy action other world corny im a hero manga is the meta we need thrilling eerie random outrageous and unpredictable stories! and the art needs more emotion than the children based ones!

Same