<<Was this your opinion, or not? And if it wasn't, what were you trying to say? >>
If you said it like that in the start, i doubt chisylle wouldn't have responded. ^^
Instead of kicking, (╯°Д °)╯╧╧ punching and grabbing IN THE AIR before an actual opponent even wanted to enter a ring of your OWN conception...
- I mean that you presume of all directions a discussion could take...
- Throw at us numerous facts with so many possibilty to respond (we would need pages and pages to do so) .
It would be, obviously time-consuming and meaningless to put this much effort in our context .
To each other, aren't we just strangers with profile pics ?
We don't matter enough to stretch things out on a boring topic ( HELL Σ( ￣□￣||), we re on mangago comment section !!! I like, when i'm on this site, to read about: mangas, Ln, games,...)
Would you go on talking about weather during a math class ?
Certainly free to do so HENCE other students are free to tell that you 're bothering them -_-
On a train, you are allowed to dislike everyone who is riding with you but as long they're not trying to offend you, let them enjoy the ride with you .
I Thot You Was a Toad :<<Not so much racist as incendiary. The image is a deliberate provocation toward a sub-section of people...>> #－.－)
Do i need to be clearer for you not to infer where i came from ;) ... Or are you going to make things up about the "concealed meaning of our phrases"...
Provocation (even more if they are;"incendiary" & "deliberate" ) are meant to provoke, we agree on this, in my opinion.
Well mission accomplished ヾ(☆▽☆) ! However everyone but you was being civil about it, and only responded to the thoughts expressed in the comments .
NOT the reading-between-the-lines-Under-influence martial art. You are the only practitioner of it here...
END i hope.
Bosh.
I understood the cultural reference between Jylland-Postens and Charlie Hebdo and the veeeeeery Japanese mangaka (fancy that! Not every Japanese mangaka walks in lockstep with Miyazaki, hmmm?) who created this satirical cartoon, immediately: a point which you and chisylle continue to dismiss and evade.
If by veeeeery dearly held values you mean I value those cartoonists' rights to create and publish satirical drawings (even puerile and unpleasant ones) which mock beliefs over those who murder or threaten murder in retaliation, yes. Nothing erratic about that.
If i'm not wrong, chisylle was talking here about what she/he wrote, not what you wrote...
END, not quite. If you continue to cherry pick random phrases and expect them to represent the entire argument, no.
When you edited my sentences to omit entire phrases, you neglected to include the most important qualifiers. So, who are those cartoons meant to provoke? You, chisylle, Muslims in general? Sorry, but no.
>On a train, you are allowed to dislike everyone who is riding with you but as long they're not trying to offend you, let them enjoy the ride with you .
In this case, the mangaka was responding to a group of people who were being offensive indeed, as in they were murderers. But how very disingenuous of you to keep dismissing that.
Salute!
<<If by veeeeery dearly held values you mean I value those cartoonists' rights to create and publish satirical drawings (even puerile and unpleasant ones) which mock beliefs over those who murder or threaten murder in retaliation, yes. Nothing erratic about that. @I Thot You Was a Toad . >>
I meant that if you valued dearly ... (read above -_- after all or not = complete freedom of speech with no restrictions whatsoever.)
, you shouldn't at the very least, CASTIGATE people for EXPRESSING THEMSELVES about what they didn't appreciate/were offended/ or whatever.
Do YOU THINK we walk in "lockstep" (thank you for teaching me this word btw ;) ) with <<...those who murder or threaten murder in retaliation...>> ? ? ?
If so, what are you doing responding to us (me especially) ? ╮(￣▽￣)╭
If you're under the assumption that we're in cahoots with the people you talk about, ARE WE WORTHY OF YOUR LETTERS, master ? ***
***
Did you understand "this cultural reference" ?
Clearly put ( don't want you to "infer" on your ownヾ(❀╹◡╹)ﾉ~ ) ,
It means you're being imperious.
***
If it's not what you think, we didn't say anything unreasonable...
AND EVEN IF WE DID!
It would have been as much our right to do so than the cartoonists you keep talking about...
Arrivederci! i hope ...
Again, putting words in my mouth. I never said either of you were in cahoots with murderers. I said that the cartoon you were so offended by was directed at murderers, not you.
Go ahead. Be offended by it. Might as well be offended by people you don't know and have never met rioting on the street somewhere in ... I don't know, insert a random city where you've never been and will never go ... because to use your logic, that's all about you, too.
>On a train, you are allowed to dislike everyone who is riding with you but as long they're not trying to offend you, let them enjoy the ride with you .
In this case, the mangaka was responding to a group of people who were being offensive indeed, as in they were murderers. But how very disingenuous of you to keep dismissing that. @I Thot You Was a Toad -
Quoting me :) , <<...but as long they're not trying to offend you...>>
I don't see how the scantrad team or the mangaka have been PERSONALLY OFFENDED ... Not that i would care because in return they offended others so the wheel keeps on turning...
Apparently you like cherry-picking too ;) but you also discard the meaning of what YOU CHOSE to lean on for argument' sake.
Quoting myself ^^ :<<Who thinks the "muslim who use violence to force their thinking on others are a major evil" gives a cent about our exchanges or mangas (well who knows actually ;) *wink to u all* ) or the mockery ?! >>
<< very disingenuous of you to keep dismissing that>>
Should i print it on T-shirts to ensure everything will take a justification in those facts (●￣(ｴ)￣●) ?
However you REACHED (okay with it) the conclusion (sort of) that i'm NOT SINCERE !
it means to you : <<there is no point in talking to someone like you>>
(▰˘◡˘▰) " Ingenuously " said... I am quite satisfied with this END.
<<Go ahead. Be offended by it. ...>>
My response :
The thing is I WASN'T offended by it.
I only wrote that people who were HAVE THE RIGHT TO EXPRESS that they are feeling insulted . :)
That's ALL !
If we're not criminals , why do you care what we think ?!
That even CONTESTING (absolute) freedom of speech is/should be allowed by freedom of speech itself...
<<And nothing else matters...>> : well you prolly know who. ;)
If we were in a Shounen setting, I Thot You Was a Toad and I would be best buddies by now :/
In a Seinen... Don't want to think about it
In a Shoujo... Passionate and tumultuous friendship/love
I won't go further than this . ⁄(⁄ ⁄·⁄ω⁄·⁄ ⁄)⁄
>I don't see how the scantrad team or the mangaka have been PERSONALLY OFFENDED ...
Is it that difficult to figure out? Apparently so.
A mangaka is a cartoonist, and the murder of cartoonists for expressing satire is on such a wholly different level of offensiveness than the satire itself, that some will choose to express their sympathy for the murdered cartoonists by using satire.
And whether the people the mangaka targets gives a cent or not, is irrelevant. It's the mangaka's freedom to express it.
If you want to break that cycle, you have to use different forms of persuasion rather than censorship.
>The thing is I WASN'T offended by it.
I only wrote that people who were HAVE THE RIGHT TO EXPRESS that they are feeling insulted . :)
That's ALL !
THANKYOU for finally saying what you mean. The tortured English, OMG.
+ <<It's the mangaka's freedom to express it. >>
I didn't contest it, but everyone have the right to express their feelings/thoughts about the satire* ( *its initial purpose being fulfilled that way ), and the people who made it ...
+ Hell (╯°Д °)╯╧╧ even if I wished to contest it,
i don't have any kind of political, economical or military power to enforce it. so my comment would have stayed nothing more than a comment.
BUT YOU CARE and it feels like maaaaagic (〜￣△￣)〜
+ Quoting myself: <<I only wrote that people who were (offended) HAVE THE RIGHT TO EXPRESS that they are feeling insulted . :)That's ALL ! >>
You : <<Is it that difficult to figure out? Apparently so. >>
Getting back at you here （￣へ￣）
+ And then again if you understood that it is difficult for me to "figure it out" .
These following words of yours SPEAK LOUDER than mine i think... (^^)
I Thot You Was a Toad : << And by more persuasive, I mean you need to appeal to people's better natures, not tell them how to live or what to read. ...>> ┗( T﹏T )┛
Is it so HARD FOR YOU PRATICE WHAT YOU PREACHED ?
+ <<If you want to break that cycle, you have to use different forms of persuasion rather than censorship. >>
Again with persuasion... Does every kind of communication involves persuasion for you d0_ob ?
I don't care about the cycle you are thinking of, i don't wish to break it &
I don't care for anything else that what i typed.
+ You are kidding me right ? I SAID IT, IMPLIED IT, DANCED ON THE RYTHM OF WHAT I MEANT (⊙…⊙ ) !
I repeated it countless times however .......#－.－)
Toad : <<THANKYOU for finally saying what you mean. The tortured English, OMG. >>
+ chisylle : <<Peoples tend to see and understand what they want to see and understand.I wonder why gruesome‡Overlord didn't interpret it like you...? >>
+ As for the " tortured English" YOU PUT yourself through it .ლ(´ڡ`ლ)
I let you know this was far from being my 1st language AGAIN YOU DID NOT PAY ATTENTION .
+ You were also informed this was neither a site to talk about such subjects neither it would be easy to have such talks ( because you need to be face to face ) for it.
Well, you definitely got everything I said wrong, so ....
But I don't agree that this is not a site to talk about such subjects, and I will continue to talk about them. Furthermore, since this is about dealing with images and IDEAS that people find offensive, and people are complaining about the inclusion of such images (even though they are the mangaka's own images), and suggesting that they have no place in a "safe" environment (ie., censored) from a site which hosts the very manga that hold these images, I think this topic is entirely germaine. Nice try, though.
And I disagree that you've been clear. Maybe more English lessons are in order.
Have I? Did you not say that you think that the creators of images which offend you are "lesser" human beings, or not?
Are you retracting that, now?
>If so, say/do whatever you want shamelessly that just make you less human in my eye.
Here, I'm talking about this part right up there.
"that just make you less human in my eye"
Also, I think you've misinterpreted the meaning of "shamelessly". In order for people to ACT shamelessly, there needs to be something in their action that they should feel ashamed of. You haven't established that with this image or mangaka.
***Again, putting words in my mouth.***
Quoting you.
***Again, putting words in my mouth.***
Quoting you.
***But your first comment makes no sense**
-Quoting you again.
why did you make mohamed as a pig siting on the coran in the last page ? for the people who are translating you shouls be asheemed
they should'nt be allowed anything racist here.